Well written. If I could pick one main reason whether or not I should consider a person's opinion in a guide, it would be how well they've written it. Your reasoning and logic also seem strong. I just picked up talon and never even thought to try utility, but I have to agree - utility is WONDERFUL for him!

CDR is so extremely important on him and to bring it as high as possible without sacrificing damage is key, I think. The tradeoff of using masteries rather than gold and an item slot for the CDR is a good move, cheers for bringing this to light for me :P

Using shurelias and maw or mortilus were great ideas! I run 9/0/21 in favor of Demolitionist, Expanded mind, and Meditation. The extra mana is far more useful than the minimal gold considering the way I play. I love MS on talon and think it's probably one of the most important stats on him. I take MS quints and almost always run boots of mobility on him. I tried lucidity a couple times for the early game CDR, but as soon as I was able to afford the rest of the cdr I switched it out with mobility. The little bit of speed you get from all these things really makes a difference. I also run CDR per/lvl glyphs instead of flat. By lvl 13 they basically even out, and I don't even get shurelia's until passed then, so they edge out, imo...and I don't wanna spend the extra for the flats :P

So, THANKS for showing something different and opening my eyes up to superior(my opinion) talon builds.

amazing, thoroughly written guide. was very helpful last week xD facing off vs other talon mids, destroying them (cough dorans/boots starters).

i love the addition for shurlyas on talon, i have always loved it, i use it on most of my AP mids, but as you can tell people think its a "support only" item.

This is a good build.

Not sure why most of the downvotes are like "LOL SHURELYA", "LOL MASTERY PAGE SUCKS".

Prob has no idea how to build an efficient Talon in real game situations. Not all games you get to build 5 Bloodthirsters.

+1

Seems like a solid build. I'm sure you'll work out any remaining issues and optimize it. Judging by your positive response to criticism, I'd say that'll happen fairly quickly.

Last thing I'll leave you with is if you're keeping Shurelya's Battlesong (if you remove it, that's fine), I'd postpone it until after Maw (I think Maw should follow Brutalizer) or even after Last Whisper. The early brutalizer should be enough CDR for a while, so it's better if you work on damage. Upgrading your philo too early lowers your burst too much. It's better to raise your burst with AD, then get CDR instead of getting 15% more CDR with only a brut+BT for damage.

Personally I think GA would be a better item to replace Shurelya's, though I'd get it fourth or later. The early philo might be okay if you have an AP top who's taking all the blues, but if you're getting blue buff I'd just skip it entirely. Anything you can do to cut down on your early purchases allows you to build faster damage.

Anyway, I'm not really a Talon expert so I can't give anything more solid than that. Perfect build or not, I'll give you a +1. :)

If you're talking about the formatting, it's known and not much I can do about it =/ Screws up on some resolutions.



You're a melee character, one who uses autoattacks in his harass combos. I like armor runes here so the minions do a bit less damage. Health runes might be a better choice though, I should matchraft that out.



It has some potential, and I'll write some more on it, but IMO it's generally more important to max Rake first for the AoE.



Probably a good idea.



I'll clean that up, I have it listed in a pair of sections anyway :P


I can only think of two or three common mids who can't push hard enough to give Talon trouble, at which point Rake is your only finger in the **** trying to slow it down and push. Thus, you really need the mp5. It also builds for mid/lategame as your sole defensive/utility item.


I should muck around with the summoners a bunch, as you point out there are some flaws with my setup. Nice suggestions!



Crit Damage is a waste of a summoner point if you never build any crit ;p But your points stand and I'll rework my listed page accordingly.



I'll make sure to emphasize Maw as a standard item now on Talon, and tweak the starting build. I still feel Philo > Shurelya's is very smart on Talon and will keep it in, but boots 3pot is def the better start.

I'll use the argument I see used about heal: Yes, technically you don't need it "if you're good". But having it A: lets you supplement your team more, and B: gives you more reach to catch people.

I like brut as an early purchase, and I have the math to back it up as cost-efficient, so it's staying as/is :)


Sure. It's definitely tricky early on since he's reliant on zoning the enemy mid to safely farm, but I'll see if I can explain it.





As above, they're slated to be reworked. Thanks!



Hmm. I'll poke at the runes some as well.



You're right, I'll drop the Soul Shroud. Wish it was better though =/

Why not sacrifice Havoc and Demolitionist and put those points towards getting Weapon Expertise ? I realize Alacrity pretty useless on talon, but considering how horrible Havoc is, I think the extra armor pen is worth it. Demolitionist isn't really too helpful either considering you're building a ton of AD and you have Noxian Diplomacy to push towers with.

I also think Greater Glyph of Magic Resist should be the core choice for glyphs. I can see that CDR is important, but you only get less than 6% from 9 glyphs, while having the extra MR early can really give you an edge. Talon is still capable of losing a mid lane in the first few levels if the AP carry gets some damage on you early (depends what AP of course), so MR really helps in that regard.

EDIT: I would also never take Soul Shroud and I don't think you should offer it as an option. It has a couple hundred more hp than Shurelya's Battlesong, while Shurelya's gives more CDR, more mp5, 30 hp5 (Soul Shroud doesn't give any at all) and a passive that is far more useful than a small CDR/mp5 aura.

instead of second blodd thirster do a trinity force

5 star guide. I always buy items like this, but my core is cdr boots + brutaliser + 2 bt. I never understand, why ppl buy tri force and ghost blade on talon, it's such a waste of money. When they have tri force, i usually got my second bt and pwnin everyone. I love ur guide, and definitely should try Shurelya on him cuz it sounds OP :3
Also i wanna some more information (maybe video) on how playin talon mid. Usually i was goin top, and i'm rly scary to go mid with dat squishy and weak at early game champ. Also dunno how to farm with melee vs burst mage on mid. Put some more explanations about this pls.

Lots of feedback here, I'm busy now but will address it all later. The guide needs touchups anyway :P

Good guide although I still feel like the crown doesn't benefit him as well as some other items could. for instance i think the frozen mallet is a more viable choice

Hi RCIX, just wanted to start off by thanking you for taking your time to make this guide! If you have time, I'd like to ask you a few minutes of your time to read my suggestions that I'd like to possibly see fixed.

First, I'd like to suggest your Mastery Tree to be changed a bit. You take Ignite as a Summoner which is very vital on an assassin like Talon. However, you don't show that you take Summoner's Wrath . From the tooltip, Summoner's Wrath grants Talon 5 AD/AP whenever Ignite is down. Since Talon is a hardcore assassin, you want to kill as much as possible or "kill on cooldown". If you don't get what I'm saying by "kill on cooldown", it's like Warwick and Nautilus jungle. You want to gank as much as possible but you HAVE to gank/kill whenever your ultimate is up and in this case, it'd be Ignite. I heavily suggest bringing over one point from Butcher that helps with CS'ing over to Summoner's Wrath because when you're fighting a champion, 2 damage to minions won't help and the 5 AD you gain after burning Ignite will help you damage a champion more and CS better since 5 AD > 2 minion damage.

Second, I'd like to brush up on a bit more of your Summoner Tree for the "Offense" category. Putting four points into Deadliness (+AD/level) without taking the +Crit Damage is really a waste of all that potential damage. If you neglect taking the +Crit Damage, I really suggest taking a point out of Demolitionist and four points into attack speed and the main reasoning for the change, +10% Armor Pen. Armor pen has been proven many times to do more damage to champions but less to creeps and that's why most people run AD just to CS better. If you're going to assassin and get up in people's face, you want to burst and Armor Pen terrorizes squishies. Your defensive tree is something I really agree on so keep that because it's fine!

Third, I'm sure you've gotten a few looks about it before and I'm going to bring it up again. I'm speaking about your Item build! I know you have your reasoning for starting Regrowth Pendant into Philo but that's extremely questionable given this metagame. If you're going mid-lane you are basically going to have to all-in yourself on a trade. Regrowth is for sustain and you need boots and potions to be agile and evade the enemy jungler because that's what the metagame is, camp top and mid. I'm aware a lot of AP mid's take GP/10 at times by that's because they have a ranged AA unlike Talon. Asides from Philosopher/Shurelya, I'd like to speak about the importance of Maw of Malmortius. If you're really dedicated to getting up in AP's faces, you need to be strong enough to maximize your damage while being able to stay alive. Maw is important and I strongly suggest prioritizing it. Final point I'd like to talk about with items is Brutalizer. Brutalizer is a very nice item for Talon but it shines when turned into a Youmuu's early/mid game and its late game is questionable. Selling a Brutalizer that hasn't turned into a Youmuu's for a BT late game is the proper move but it's honestly a waste of time and gold farming up a Brutalizer and not upgrading it. You really lose the potential of rushing other items. Also since I'm speaking about Youmuu's and Shurelya's and you talked about it in your item choices, I'm going to be blunt about it and I apologize if it offends you. If you are a good Talon, you don't need to rely on the Shurelya move speed.

Anyways, that's all I wanted to point out about your guide. I'd really love to see these things changed but it's your guide so I can't force you to. Asides from what I said, it looks pretty and you have most of your points correct so I definitely have to commend you for that. If you have any questions/comments, please PM me, thanks!

I don't agree with the phil stone / shurelyas AT ALL. I've been playing him since they reduced the mana cost on his rake and I don't find him that mana hungry if you don't spam. You could say "every mid needs mana, so let's get a phil stone" but this sets you back in your build. I would much rather prefer boots 3 health pots start.

BESIDES THAT (which I really think you should change) The build / guide is great. Lots of great info, I love how you compare Talon to other popular jungles / tops to show why he's not very good in those roles. Lots of good info on items. Really I don't have anything else to complain about besides that phil stone / shurelya's!!!