Shouldn't Lose LP if Auto Filled

[quote=Ekki][quote=Lasoor]I play support very well and Triumph.gg says I played the support game I'm referring to on a Platinum level. Obviously that site isn't completely accurate, but it does show I did good. It gave most of my team bronze scores.[/quote]I doubt an automated system would know anything (literally, not even as an approximation) of how would a high elo support play on low elo. It's the hardest to measure role for very good reasons. Then again, the rest of the roles miiight work as approximations but even that might be wrong. [quote=Lasoor]I play support very well [...] I take the role seriously when I get it, but I just can't carry with it.[/quote]So you don't play support very well if you can't carry with it. Not blaming you though, the game may have been a lost game anyways, but it's a bit more complex than "feeling you played well". [quote=Lasoor]Alright good to know. Kind of sad though that dodging would be encouraged to get around it. You know a system is bad when it can be cheated like that and then creates another problem. Definitely explains why it takes me like 10 minutes to get into a game because people dodge so much.[/quote]You're not encouraged to get around it though. If you're a bad support it might be better [u]for you[/u] to dodge. Personally, support might be my second best role, but I'd never put it as a secondary role because that's asking to play over half your games as support. And there are lots of people in a similar position, so not having autofill would add some minutes to the queue.[/quote]

[quote=Lasoor][quote]I doubt an automated system would know anything (literally, not even as an approximation) of how would a high elo support play on low elo. It's the hardest to measure role for very good reasons. Then again, the rest of the roles miiight work as approximations but even that might be wrong. [/quote] It's actually a very accurate website and they account for it being low elo. Like I said, it's not going to be perfect, but it gives you a good idea. My teammates in the game were shown as bronze skill which was very accurate. But the fact that even games I do terribly on show me as having done a gold or platinum skill level goes to show the system takes a lot of things into account, not just kda or if you won or lost. [quote]So you don't play support very well if you can't carry with it. Not blaming you though, the game may have been a lost game anyways, but it's a bit more complex than "feeling you played well".[/quote] How does one carry a game as [[Taric]] support. Teach me your ways wise one. [[Taric]] requires the team to have capability to carry them. Otherwise you can be perfect, not saying I was, but your team won't utilize what you do to them and would just die anyway. It's not like [[Blitzcrank]] where you just land your hookshot and get your team a kill. [quote]You're not encouraged to get around it though. If you're a bad support it might be better for you to dodge. Personally, support might be my second best role, but I'd never put it as a secondary role because that's asking to play over half your games as support. And there are lots of people in a similar position, so not having autofill would add some minutes to the queue.[/quote] I was just encouraged to get around it though. I'd be fine with longer wait times if it meant I got the role I wanted.[/quote]

[quote=Ekki]First, sorry if I'm being too pedantic. It's not personal, and sorry if I sound too harsh, I learnt most of my english from internet discussions. That said... [quote=Lasoor]It's actually a very accurate website and they account for it being low elo. Like I said, it's not going to be perfect, but it gives you a good idea. My teammates in the game were shown as bronze skill which was very accurate. But the fact that even games I do terribly on show me as having done a gold or platinum skill level goes to show the system takes a lot of things into account, not just kda or if you won or lost.[/quote]You just can't "account for being low elo". There is no equation for it. Also, your teammates being what [i]you[/i] expected them to be doesn't change how it works for the support role, which is highly reliant on skills you can't measure out of the metrics the API gives. [quote=Lasoor]How does one carry a game as [[Taric]] support. Teach me your ways wise one. [[Taric]] requires the team to have capability to carry them. Otherwise you can be perfect, not saying I was, but your team won't utilize what you do to them and would just die anyway. It's not like [[Blitzcrank]] where you just land your hookshot and get your team a kill.[/quote]IDK how you should play [[taric]], but even if it was way harder to carry with him, the problem changes to the fact that you should play a support with which you [u]can[/u] carry. [quote=Lasoor]I was just encouraged to get around it though. I'd be fine with longer wait times if it meant I got the role I wanted.[/quote]This part is actually Rito's weigh of the pros vs cons of the autofill function. There has been a "never get me X position" tested in LAN/LAS (I play in LAS) and apparently it didn't work too well because people were basically using it always as support. But it comes to show they're trying to work around it somehow. I guess the tl;dr is that you should either try to play a support with which you are able to carry or just dodge if it's the first dodge of the day (iirc subsequent dodges get higher LP loss).[/quote]

[quote=Lasoor]I've played multiple support champions and the one I am overall best with and most useful with is [[Taric]] which is why I pick him. As long as I get a adc that can do something then I always win the laning phase. It is late game that is the issue because it becomes reliant on other people. That's what support is about, it is putting your hopes into another person. You get your team stronger so they can win the game. If they mess up then there's not much more you can do. Sure sometimes you can finish enemies off if your ally fails, but you're no Master Yi when it comes to clean ups. Supports have their limits, their strengths rely on teammates.[/quote]

[quote=Kazega]Hold on gang I am going ot take a stab at this [quote=Lasoor]Who else agrees[/quote] THis tells me and should tell everyone else that our opinions are invalid to you. Your mind is made up at this point and any valid points (Namely that YOU LOST ANYWAY) is going to fall on deaf ears [quote]that if you are auto filled to a role you didn't want you shouldn't lose LP if you lose the match?[/quote]Clearly you don't remember the times of "Pick order" I remember when it felt like every other game I was randomly selected to be the "Bitch Pick" The last pick on Red side. SO I had to roll with what ever was picked before me. [quote]Just played a game where I was auto filled to support and paired with a Vayne who was a first time Vayne player. In end we lost and I got an S, but lost 16 LP. So unfair...[/quote]This is only unfair to you. I'm looking at the damage numbers and a few other things, and as a team, the other team just did better. So would it make sense to be unfair to one person? or be unfair to 4 people in this case? [quote]I don't play support yet did amazing and still got brought down in ranked. Auto fill is the reason I don't play ranked much. Because every time I got a winning streak it puts me in support and then I lose.[/quote] I don't see any substantial winning streaks in your Match history. yeah, you have a few streaks of 2 or 3 but I don't see any larger streaks in your history [quote]Only issue with this is then auto filled players could just troll if they didn't lose LP.[/quote]And this is why every ranked game counts. Thanks for playing but you tripped at the finish line and defeated your own argument. Stop whining because even if you were in the top lane or Jungle like your match history suggests, you still would have lost. and you still would have bitched about it.[/quote]

[quote=Ekki]And here I was hoping this had ended as a friendly discussion.[/quote]

[quote=Lasoor]Sheesh you're hostile man.... And honestly you didn't really make any point aside from claim I'm being closed minded then proceeding to be close minded. We were having an actual discussion and then you ride in here on your high horse after it ended. [quote]Clearly you don't remember the times of "Pick order" I remember when it felt like every other game I was randomly selected to be the "Bitch Pick" The last pick on Red side. SO I had to roll with what ever was picked before me.[/quote] Considering I started playing Season 5 and didn't play Ranked until Season 6, ya I don't remember "Bitch Pick". And I'm certainly not going to hold back complaints with a current system just because it's better than how it used to be. Anything can be improved more. [quote]I don't see any substantial winning streaks in your Match history. yeah, you have a few streaks of 2 or 3 but I don't see any larger streaks in your history [/quote] Um really? Are you looking at the same match history I am? I win nearly every Ranked game. I've only lost a few of them recently and that was mostly just promos because I got bad luck. I then quickly got to do the promos again and passed it. In like a day and a half I went from Bronze 3 to Bronze 2 100 LP. And that's also with a lot of normal games mixed into that time frame. Anyone could tell from my match history that I am in a lower elo than I belong, hence me getting out of it so quickly and easily. op.gg Says I got a 65% win rate and mixed in there are auto fill games I lost and games I lost as champions I don't normally play in ranked and was just trying out like [[Xin Zhao]]. I am "testing the waters" so to speak to see what I am best at in ranked. Currently my best champions are [[Yorick]], [[Warwick]], and [[Aatrox]]. I got a 60% win rate on [[Aatrox]], 87% win rate on [[Warwick]], and 82% win rate on [[Yorick]] all for ranked as of writing this. I am also currently on a 5 win streak with [[Warwick]]. Almost all my wins are done in streaks.[/quote]

[quote=Kazega]ALright guy I got three points before this can be laid to rest. First your wins aren't ever in streaks outside of your current 5 win streak, for which you have my genuine, yet mild, applause. You have clustered patterns but no streaks of either winning or losing. Plus your idea of :almost all" seems to have a very wide margin as you have a 59% win rate in ranked. If you said "almost all Warwick games" then you might have had a point, but as it stands this on falls pretty flat. But as it stands you are climbing the ladder with that win rate all the same, so once again, mild applause. Second, you seem to be rather fond of shifting blame. Let's take your original complaint of being auto-filled to support and then S classing with that role. for a third time you get some mild applause, but otherwise you are just whining about something you can't fix. and a wise man once said [img]http://i.imgur.com/naSBSMR.jpg[/img] My last point is that this is all just a QQ thread in disguise and it should have been locked a while ago because there is a bigger one in the pinned threads. All you want is a pat on the back and a lollipop for life being unfair to you. Suck it up buttercup, you are doing just fine.[/quote]

[quote=Lasoor]If you're looking at my history through op.gg then you clearly don't understand that it leaves out a lot of matches which is something I have noticed when using it for past month. I just looked and it left out most of my won matches and made it look like I had no win streaks. Almost all my wins are done in streaks, which is something I've noticed since I started Ranked. It would be impossible to rise in ranked if you never got win streaks. And I am rising rapidly. How much I win is not at all an issue related to this thread either. This thread is about specific issue of Riot auto filling you to roles you probably don't even play and then having it count in a ranked league that shows how skilled you are. When you are auto filled it is not in any way an accurate representation of your overall skill level because it is likely that you are being auto filled to a role you aren't that great in. The entire point I made in this thread is legitimate which is why that is not what people argued against. There is no rational way to make the claim that being ranked Silver for games played in a role you are bad at means you are actually deserving of Silver. That's just an example. It's not like they just make you auto fill for regular ranked games. They make you do it for placements too. I had to auto fill 3 times in my placements. Regardless you are being outright ridiculous in your aggressive response to a simple discussion topic. Feel free to disagree but being a total dictator about it pretending you're the only one who has the right answer on it is hypocritical and ridiculous. There was no 'whining' being done anywhere on this thread other than your whining about the thread being made. Also worth pointing out this isn't a problem only I have with it. http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/RydwTH4X-auto-filled-players-should-lose-less-lp-in-losses-and-gain-more-in-wins http://boards.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/champions-gameplay-en/H0pskABj-autofill-is-losing-me-lp http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/TIndJtsq-ok-seriously-autofill-on-solo-queue-you-really-want-ranked-to-have-0-legitimacy I know every role and can play every role. However no reasonable person can expect me to play every role on a high skill level when I only started really playing the game at end of Season 6. Before that I played a little in Season 5. I can play Jungle, Top, and Mid on a Gold level imo however according to triumph.gg it is a platinum level. I feel I play Support and ADC on a silver level. I don't even want to consider playing bot lane unless I am in call with my fellow laner. Otherwise how am I supposed to properly communicate quickly and efficiently. And how am I supposed to rely on someone I don't even know. It's hard enough just getting people to engage on their enemy laner in a lost battle while I'm jungle ganking. (Reason you do that is it entices the enemy to stay to get a kill, distracts them, and also baits the enemy farther from their turret which means you are a lot more likely to successfully gank them)[/quote]

[quote=Kazega][quote=Lasoor]If you're looking at my history through op.gg then you clearly don't understand that it leaves out a lot of matches which is something I have noticed when using it for past month. I just looked and it left out most of my won matches and made it look like I had no win streaks. Almost all my wins are done in streaks, which is something I've noticed since I started Ranked.[/quote]Special Pleading Fallacy: you are trying to make excuses for something after you have been proven wrong. Also if anything op.gg is adding games because Riot is only showing me your Ranked games as a match history [quote]It would be impossible to rise in ranked if you never got win streaks. And I am rising rapidly.[/quote]Clearly this is False. Positive patterns, also contribute to climbing. Simply put you don't have to streak at all, even to get promoted in a series. [quote]How much I win is not at all an issue related to this thread either.[/quote]Then why did you bring up win rates? All I mentioned was how "streaky" your match history really was as you mentioned it when you first posted this thread. [quote]This thread is about specific issue of Riot auto filling you to roles you probably don't even play and then having it count in a ranked league that shows how skilled you are.When you are auto filled it is not in any way an accurate representation of your overall skill level because it is likely that you are being auto filled to a role you aren't that great in.[/quote] You obviously don't know what "skill" means then. Just because you are a better jungler than a support doesn't mean you shouldn't be measured in how well you support if the chance arises [quote]The entire point I made in this thread is legitimate which is why that is not what people argued against.[/quote] I am pretty sure everyone said "that's a bad idea" [quote]There is no rational way to make the claim that being ranked Silver for games played in a role you are bad at means you are actually deserving of Silver. That's just an example. It's not like they just make you auto fill for regular ranked games. They make you do it for placements too. I had to auto fill 3 times in my placements. [/quote]Guy? you were placed based on how you played, no matter what role you got. there is plenty of Rational for you to be in Bronze II because that's how you played. [quote]Regardless you are being outright ridiculous in your aggressive response to a simple discussion topic. Feel free to disagree but being a total dictator about it pretending you're the only one who has the right answer on it is hypocritical and ridiculous. [/quote] The truth hurts man. Also this is not, and never was, a discussion thread. It never was a discussion. Once again, you brought out an idea and all the responses were "bad idea." You even said it was a bad idea. Also this is an Ad Homonim Fallacy. You are attacking my character to get support for your side. [quote]There was no 'whining' being done anywhere on this thread other than your whining about the thread being made.[/quote]Well you are entitled to your opinion but I doubt I would be whining. just trying to get you to stop. [quote]Also worth pointing out this isn't a problem only I have with it. http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/RydwTH4X-auto-filled-players-should-lose-less-lp-in-losses-and-gain-more-in-wins http://boards.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/champions-gameplay-en/H0pskABj-autofill-is-losing-me-lp http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/TIndJtsq-ok-seriously-autofill-on-solo-queue-you-really-want-ranked-to-have-0-legitimacy[/quote]Band Wagon Fallacy. This is an attempt to make your opinion more popular than it really is and therefore must have some validity [quote]I know every role and can play every role.[/quote]So can I, and, like you, results are pretty mixed when I play off roles. [quote]However no reasonable person can expect me to play every role on a high skill level when I only started really playing the game at end of Season 6.[/quote] and what about the old pros like DoubleLift and Dyrus? Those two in particular are from Season 1 or earlier. Anyway this is another Goalpost move, using time played as an excuse [quote]Before that I played a little in Season 5. I can play Jungle, Top, and Mid on a Gold level imo however according to triumph.gg it is a platinum level.[/quote] This is anecdotal and a Red herring. these don't have anything to do with the argument at hand. Your skill was never in question. You just feel the need to bring it up to try and justify your point of view. [quote]I feel I play Support and ADC on a silver level. I don't even want to consider playing bot lane unless I am in call with my fellow laner. Otherwise how am I supposed to properly communicate quickly and efficiently. And how am I supposed to rely on someone I don't even know.[/quote]Begging the Question. If you don't know how to do this sort of thing then you probably should learn. [quote]It's hard enough just getting people to engage on their enemy laner in a lost battle while I'm jungle ganking. (Reason you do that is it entices the enemy to stay to get a kill, distracts them, and also baits the enemy farther from their turret which means you are a lot more likely to successfully gank them)[/quote]The keyword here is "Lost" If you are jungling and you notice a "Lost" fight if you are ganking and your lane just "lost" a fight beyond your help, well then your time is better spent elsewhere. Bottom Line, Everyone thinks that your idea is a bad idea. You even said so yourself in the OP. The only reason you think I'm a bad person at this point is because I am not sugar coating anything for you. I'm just laying out cold hard facts and you don't like it. I think you are 'whining' because you are raging about an issue that you can't fix, and you know you can't fix it. You think I am 'whining' because I put all this effort into getting you to stop whining, but you aren't listening. As I have said before, this isn't a discussion thread. This is a Rage induced QQ Thread because you got an S rank and still lost. and you aren't special for that either. It's happened to everyone. Shit happens. This is not going to get 'fixed' so deal with it.[/quote]