Ryze Counters

[quote=CasterMaster]Which means [[ryze]] counters [[veigar]], but I think a champion with a stun would do the best. That, or [[talon]]. Mid [[talon]] is quite popular lately[/quote]

[quote=Vitigam]Yeah, [[Talon]] mid is pretty annoying, but not that big of a threat if you can harass him from a distance.[/quote]

[quote=Searz][quote=DuffTime] I just think his impact on a game is low when compared to more devastating single action champions like Cass or single target DPSers like Ryze. Swain just sorta DoTs the fuck out of one guy and walks around shootings birds and meh.[/quote] Swain's burst is better than Ryze's. Swain doesn't have much instant burst per se, but he has burst over 2seconds. It's all his E. The damage increase on it is borderline OP. Both his single target and AoE damage is pretty high. His only real weakness would be that he's weak against kiting, imo.[/quote]

[quote=Slappiz]Swain is really strong mid game, amazing burst and tankiness with few items, but somehow I feel that his effectiveness gets weaker in end game.[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime][quote=Searz] Swain's burst is better than Ryze's. Swain doesn't have much instant burst per se, but he has burst over 2seconds. It's all his E. The damage increase on it is borderline OP. Both his single target and AoE damage is pretty high. His only real weakness would be that he's weak against kiting, imo. [/quote] Of course his single spell rotation does more damage than ryze's single spell rotation on a single target, but I don't really agree that he has more burst, simply because Ryze's damage can potentially chunk the whole team if they're clumped up. It happens all the time at all levels of play, the enemy groups too tight and Ryze turns with ulti and chunks the fock out of them. Also, Ryze is a sustained DPS so his burst is supposed to lower, and it is against a single target, but over time he will out DPS a Swain. If he can stay on a target, he will generally have the better damage output. I've played some Swain and I've seen how he works. He can deal a lot of damage and while I recognize that, I'm just not a big fan of his ulti outside of lane phase and I just feel that all in all he's a lower impact champion than some of the alternative options.[/quote]

[quote=CasterMaster][[swain]] and [[ryze]] are quite similar champions if you think about it. [[ryze]] is more burst-typed when [[swain]] just continually deals a crap load of damage. [[swain]] would be stronger in lane but in a team fight [[ryze]] could most likely deal more damage to a SINGLE target. Especially if they let him combo like: [center][[overload]]-->[[spell flux]]-->[[overload]]-->[[rune prison]]-->[[overload]]-->[[desperate power]]-->[[overload]]-->[[spell flux]]-->[[overload]]-->[[rune prison]]-->[[overload]][/center] Probably the deadliest combo around, can probably kill 2 carries if not more.[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime]They're both more towards sustained DPS as far as casters go, but both deal some burst. TBH Swain has amazing single target DPS, as does Ryze. I just think Ryze is a higher impact champion.[/quote]

[quote=CasterMaster]I think if you put [[ryze]] and [[swain]] in a similar situation, they'd do about the same.[/quote]

[quote=BarbJ]I've been hearing that Ryze > Morgana > Sion > Ryze So with that in mind, Ryze would be countered (or at least have a disadvantage) when confronted with a Sion in lane.[/quote]

[quote=Zoki]I really don't see how a fast-response Ryze could lose to Sion. I'd say a good counter for Ryze is a champ, that can outrange him. I played few games as Xerath against Ryze and if you can take advantage of your ranges, you can eventually prevent him from comboing you every time you want to duel.[/quote]