*Cough Cough*

Kalista is FotM now. I'll have your review here tomorrow!

Sorry Im late!

Thy sins
1. Wits end on an ADC build is a nono, especially considering you don't sell it later on.
2. The different builds present different defensive items, although the defensive items apply for both builds.
3. Don't add "experimental" builds to your guide, only keep the "I know for sure that this works" in your guide.
4. No runes, summoner spell nor mastery explanations in your guide
5. No enchantment options in cheatsheet7. "Green: Tips and tricks" Nice, so where is the green text?
8. "First put points in Fate's Call whenever available, then max Pierce, then max Rend second and . An early point in Sentinel can give you situational awareness of the jungle nearby, but max Sentinel as your last skill." This is nice and all, but I have no idea why you max it in this order.
9. "Your utimate ability" Ultimate*
10. "Pick two or all" No. Pick last whisper and 1 lifesteal item. Double lifesteal not worth it because if you get CC'd, lifesteal isn't gonna save ya whereas defensive items do. Last Whisper is a must because else you deal no damage.
11. Don't get frozen heart on an ADC. You need the HP and defense stats combo, else it has no use. Guardian Angle is an exception because of its unique passive and Mercurial Scimitar is an exception because of its amazing active ability.
12. Wits end is NOT a defensive item.
13. Double explanations because you explain two builds seperately whereas they are almost the same.
14. Tactical section is highly lacking. Some tips and tricks isn't enough, you need to explain what you must do early, mid and lategame. Then explain how you can do these things and when you should do these things. Thing like harassment, farming, splitpushing, dragon, teamfighting, etc.
15. No C2V

Thy blessing
1. Build in general seems fine.
2. Decent use of structure and coding
3. Bonus: Synergies

Result: Path of the Infidel
A lot of important sections in your guide are missing and a lot of unnecessary sections are given. Runes, masteries, summoner spells and tactics especially should be part of the guide because they can play a large enough role in the game to be the difference between winning and losing. If the reader would just blindly follow your runes, masteries and summoner spells and there is a situation where these sets are suboptimal, then the reader will not know why things aren't going as smoothly. With the tactics it is very important to explain because builds are fun and all, but if you do not know how to use them then you aren't really getting anywhere are you.

Then, besides the missing sections, there are also some double sections or sections that are plain wrong within the guide. Naturally, I suggest that you remove these sections and only keep in the things that are relevant. Especially the defensive items can be explained way better.

If you would fix all the things that I suggested, your guide will improve a lot. Any questions? Feel free to shoot me some PM's.

Good luck!
-Meiyjhe

As your guide has less than 5 votes, according to the rules stated in the OP of the review shop, you will gain a downvote. Check out the review shop for more information about the scoring. If you liked or disliked my review, please also go to my review shop to leave a post or tell me in PM what you think.

Hey, it's fine by me.
I find this discussion intriguing, as it does concern the champ I made the guide for.
I find myself to agree more with Kinky Kalista though, on itemization, after having tested vast amounts of builds. Attack speed and an early Statikk Shiv or Blade of the Ruined King does feel insanely good on her. And no, she doesn't lack a punch just because of it.

You do realize this isn't your own guide, right...? After emoriam's and Janitsu's comments, you should have replied through PM, not spam this guy's discussion on his guide.

I just used Lucian as an example because you use it in your guide. I think I've been fair in my coclusion. The fact that I play Lucian doesn't mean I would favor him but it means I understand the match up.

"The point is that Lucian won't do a 3 AA trade. You will get shoved"

Probable, not WILL happen. Not EVERY player plays the same way.
Seems like you've got things backwards.

If you want to be fair, how about considering the fact that not every single player who plays Lucian will play that way?

EDIT: Actually forget it. I won't bother with you anymore, you're ridiculous, literally. You say that I'm wrong about a few things and go on about ganks, supports, minions, etc. (Or was that you? Either way) and when I'm open to do so, you then go on about playstyle and follow up with Lucian will do this, Lucian will do that. We're not talking about PROFESSIONAL ESPORTS players here... (By the way, even they do huge mistakes and uncalled for plays, e.x: Amazing at the 2014 WC Final.) In other words, NO. Lucian WON'T do this *Every time* - In fact, 20% of every League of Legends player make up the Platinum - Challenger tiers. 80% make up the lower brackets of: Gold, Silver and Bronze, based on RIOT's statistics. So, on behalf of players who make up 80% of the community, with an overwhelming majority of players overall making mistakes every single day, I rest my case here. If you want fair, be fair yourself. Lucian isn't playing, the human being in control of Lucian is playing with a kit and math difference specifically on him. I'm going to continue with improving my guide contently within my own peace, without acknowledging you from now on, because clearly we know who's biased here. The users: Janitsu and Luther3000 have been excellent with their attitude and have never once said something WILL happen, which is good on them, I've also never once said something will happen on either side, I am only calculating damage output and stats, with what would be the most PROBABLE outcome. Not DEFINITE outcome. ^^
Oh and I noticed that Lucian is the first on your FAVE champs list.. Hm. Anyway, I'm going to go catch myself some sleep, it's late where I live. Have a nice night, Joxuu. Perhaps maybe you'll think this over for yourself and realize that what I'm saying has truth. It's been a displeasure. Bye.

The point is that Lucian won't do a 3 AA trade. You will get shoved, poked by his Q and
then get Relentless Pursuit engage for 1 AA when minions are shoving your way. You get
1 Aa max back at him but you lose to Lightslinger passive + damage taken from minion
aggro. The trade goes even worse if Lucian has Q back up.

The way you're explaining every single fight which is beneficial for Kalista is like
comparing Caitlyn going to melee range against Garen and they trade 1:1 auto attacks.

For this guide:

IE into Statikk Shiv is better than PD. You mention statikk to be core but you don't
even take the item in your final build. I would delay Last Whisper after BT and
take other more safe defensive item than merc scim in your final build.

Most of the situational items you introduce are bad too. Overall the guide seems
little bit unfinished and needs in-depth information.

Won't be voting but good luck with the guide.

How about I go run a 2v2 simulation quickly and what results show I will provide?

In a simulation: Mastery pages + Runes upon base stats of any support/ad carry.
Conducting the Martial Poise to only dodge what cast timers are lesser to it's own, evaluating what damage would hit and what would not?

Basically, the ultimate outcome possible for each side, fairly.

Give me an AD Carry of your choice and Support as a match up AGAINST Kalista and what support of your choice will be supporting Kalista, as well as what abilities are taken on said champions. Only, that Kalista has her Pierce and Rend. Nothing will be altered, it will be the right readings.

Programs I will be using:

Cinema 4D - for the models of said champions and their ability animations/attack animations set to what attack speed they have.

idunnolol - Simple script calculating the differences between attack damage output through abilities and auto attacks and the armor of said champions. (I will evaluate the sheet myself and provide it, which will be less hassle for anyone who's interested in knowing the outcome of a 2v2 that involves Kalista.)

Conducting outcome:

Screening - Extract contents from the League of Legends folder to a seperate screen and write a script to have the champions follow an algorithm that follows the same path as the simulation and idunnolol calculation to see the outcome.
______________________________________________________________
Junglers will not be evaluated - When researching, possibilities that are not impossible, but are improbable or probable, are never involved in an algorithm of any sort like this.
______________________________________________________________
Just name the Supports for each side and who belongs to what carry, as well as the carry of your choice that is not Graves or Draven. Give the Mastery pages + Runes for each support and the enemy AD Carry of choice.

It will take an hour.


______________________________________________________________
Note: This will be a 1-2-3 AA and ability evaluation, nothing more, nothing less. Considering the amount of attack animations that will happen within the duration of a 3-4 second trade. A mere 2 auto attacks would not be the limit.

Also take note that some AD carries have higher based health, but lose trades. In this case, a second trade would allow the AD carry that won with the lower base Health to be at a higher base Health. Basically, even if one AD carry turns out to have less Health, does not mean that they lost the trade, but rather have more health on the second trade that happens. :) Like with Lucian, Lucian would end up having 293 health at the end of two trades that follow the same algorithm between himself and Kalista in a 1v1.

Also yes, I WILL include the calculation from minions as well. It will be one wave of 6 normal minions on each side with their aggro considered. I will find a way.

I don't want to make any conclusions until i see kinky kalista's calculations. I'm sure kalista beats most ADCs on extended trades, but i'd really like to see the damage tables you generated for 1-2 AAs plus spells for various champions, since those kinds of trades are quite frequent in the bot lane

Kinky Kalista, you clearly have a very false impression of how trading works. Of course, Kalista can outdamage everyone in an extended trade BUT an at least decent adc will not give you ths chance. Kallista's base AA range is mediocre and she does not have a reliable poke ability, meaning that most adcs can exploit this range difference and punish you before you even manage to attack back. Additionally, Kalista's instant burst is really low early game and she is very very likely to lose most trades in lane unless they last over 5 seconds.

Most pros and high elo players, who tried Kalista, agreed that her laning is pretty weak and her trading potentkal low. Most trades in lane will not be extended skirmishes or all in fights, as long as the enemy has enough game knowledge.

As some people (including me) said in your guide's discussion; you can't take every aspect of the fight into account. You can't count minion aggro, range, dodging, support, supports' skill etc. and therefore it's a bold claim when you say that ONLY Graves and Draven win trades against you. Lucian can easily win trades as well and can probably poke better. What about the health lost when someone pokes you and when you trade with lower health than the other person? There are too many different situations for your calculations to be viable. Only case would probably be in the river without any other enemies nearby.

...Really... No. Even Lucian loses trades with Kalista when she is ran with attack speed. My guide has a full sheet of calculating every aspect respectfully with her utilizing Martial Poise due to the benefit of having 0.79 attack speed towards level 2. She only loses in damage output to Graves and Draven. It took 48 hours to calculate damage difference between her and all other ad carries, Graves and Draven are the only ones, mate.

Your way of the game is different to my way of the game. Only difference is I'm dedicated to Kalista in every way, I want to research her more and more. Kalista with flat AS quints and the appropriate masteries (SW+BW especially for Rend) makes her out damage EVERY ad carry except two. THAT is strong.

Although I'm not going to argue, I've already suggested to this MOBAFIRE member something on my behalf, he can choose to listen to me or anyone else, it doesn't matter. I've already experienced Kalista enough to say that she is strong early against every but two ad carries. Although, 2v2 is different, but doesn't change damage output between two carries. However, throw a sustaining support into the mix and Kalista will win 8 times out of 10. Personal opinion. Because if you're unfortunate, there may be a Caitlyn and Soraka/ Sona combo you're against, which makes me cry.


EDIT: That sounded confusing! I meant Kalista with a Support that can heal her. But it would be unfortunate to be playing against Caitlyn if she has a healing support as well.


Anyway, I'm going to stop chatting here, go ahead and listen to whoever you want, OP. <3 Good luck with your unique(?) sustaining guide for Kalista! Upvoted, since I'm sure you will keep improving it!