A Flash Free Season Three!

[quote=GrandmasterD][quote=throatslasher] 5 bucks says you run ghost in 100% of your games. If you really want to impress me, hit platinum while running neither ghost nor flash. Going exhaust-smite junglers every game doesn't count :p [/quote] Played five games of [[Cleanse]]/[[Ignite]] [[Diana]]. Works incredibly well. It's also a setup I use on [[Kassadin]].[/quote]

[quote=Jovy]i need flash to dive. i can't sacrifice diving.[/quote]

[quote=bsurma]Seeing how DOTA solves this somewhat with their Blink Dagger... Well, I don't know. [[flash]] just feels kinda stupid in some situations where death can be easily avoided, but removing it altogether would make for a quite different game. I have mixed feelings about this. I know that [[flash]] has been abused throughout the two seasons, but I see it as a necessary evil. In DOTA2, they have Blink Daggers, but for me this doesn't exactly solve the problem in LoL. It would make it worse.[/quote]

[quote=RaNuD]Would require LOTS of champion tweaks in the first weeks. Anyway, GrandmasterD for president.[/quote]

[quote=Shuru]I see flash as a means to execute risky plays that can otherwise change a game with a chance to get out if they go wrong. Teleport/flash baron steals for example.[/quote]

[quote=FalseoGod][quote=Shuru] I see flash as a means to execute risky plays that can otherwise change a game with a chance to get out if they go wrong. Teleport/flash baron steals for example. [/quote] To be honest, that's the situation where 99% of the time I hate having teammates with [[flash]]: they just go in with flash, fail the steal, die and compromise the game. It's so bloody annoying. I see a lot of people doing crap because they have flash and they have the "I can run away mindset" (specially those hateful good-for-nothing-die-in-a-pyre-of-yordle-guano AD Carries), but I've see people do brilliant stuff because they could flash into this or that position. I agree with interruptible flash, disagree with silence after flash (as Teem said, it promotes "bail out" flash, not the aggressive one).[/quote]

[quote=GrandmasterD][quote=Shuru] I see flash as a means to execute risky plays that can otherwise change a game with a chance to get out if they go wrong. Teleport/flash baron steals for example. [/quote] So what you're saying is that people can make dumb plays and don't have to think about things because they have [[Flash]]? Yes, that is exactly my point.[/quote]

[quote=Shuru][quote=FalseoGod] To be honest, that's the situation where 99% of the time I hate having teammates with [[flash]]: they just go in with flash, fail the steal, die and compromise the game. It's so bloody annoying. I see a lot of people doing crap because they have flash and they have the "I can run away mindset" (specially those hateful good-for-nothing-die-in-a-pyre-of-yordle-guano AD Carries), but I've see people do brilliant stuff because they could flash into this or that position. I agree with interruptible flash, disagree with silence after flash (as Teem said, it promotes "bail out" flash, not the aggressive one). [/quote] what I'm getting from this thread is that everyone hates the fact that one doesn't need to learn how to use flash in a way that makes great plays, and are fed up with people who don't know how to use it, and not the summoner spell itself. when I use a jungler with flash, I'll tend to sneak in smite baron and flash the wall. once with maokai I twisted advanced onto thier tank, smited baron, flashed the wall and escaped. Flash as a defensive means can be very effective for getting out of ganks early game. What people don't seem to understand is that if a person burns flash on a gank, then you can just come right back later and hit them for it. flash is a neccisary evil. people who don't learn to use it properly will always be stuck making those terrible plays that make us angry. That however doesn't mean that there aren't characters like maokai, or ammumu, or Galio, who make great use of flash. That being said every time I see flash on someone like Olaf I rage because why? And no, that is NOT what I said. a risky play is a play that could cost you your life but not entirely throw the game, a dumb play is a play that is often made multiple times despite the knowledge of the last play. Example of a smart play, Galio flashes and ults into a team of five. Example of a dumb play, Sivir flashses the wall to baron steal, gets CCed, dies without getting baron because she didn't have smite to steal baron, or a way to escape because she burnt her only escape failing. She does it again next fight and asks why it's not working.[/quote]

[quote=FalseoGod]People are "raging" because the spell [i]is[/i] broken and there should be a way to make it value good strategic use while simultaneously punishing idiots who just go full dumb and save their asses just because they can [[flash]] out. I know I've done this too.[/quote]

[quote=Shuru][quote=FalseoGod] People are "raging" because the spell [i]is[/i] broken and there should be a way to make it value good strategic use while simultaneously punishing idiots who just go full dumb and save their asses just because they can [[flash]] out. I know I've done this too. [/quote] It's to complicated to fix flash in a way that would make the game understand when someone used a good play or a bad play and award or punish them for it. Even then a good and a bad play are biased. I think flash plays that save a person during a chase that lasts 45 seconds are pretty cool, but I think flash plays that get the ADC killed because they think the position they want is "LOL IM GONNA GO KILL THEM KTHNX." I like flash, and not because I need a get out of jail free card, but because it opens up chances for my to make game changing plays. I hardly ever need it as a get out of jail free card and when I do it was my fault I was in such a situation.[/quote]