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Support Build Theory

Creator: DaRealWario
August 29, 2012 3:43pm
27 posts page 1 of 3 Forums » General Discussion » Support Build Theory
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by DaRealWario » August 29, 2012 3:43pm | Report
Watching veterans stream, I'm wondering how effective Profit Items and Wards are as a standard build, regardless of what champion is being played...
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by BluAnimal » August 29, 2012 3:49pm | Report
You grab the gold per 5 items ( philosopher's stone, Heart of Gold, kage's lucky pick, Avarice Blade) on champions that either:

A. Function with a cheap build ( Aegis of the Legion, shurelya's reverie). So someone that is there mainly for the disables and what not.

Or B. Someone who farms poorly or needs the extra advantage over their lane ( Jarvan IV and Shen are my two choices for Heart of Gold)

If you take say Vayne and just build Avarice Blade and Heart of Gold on her she won't be effective because neither item will build into an item useful on her (implying you're not stupid enough to buy youmoo's ghostblade) and the sight wards will simply put off her build till later.
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by DaRealWario » August 29, 2012 3:56pm | Report
Well getting off a Zekent stream, his Dr Mundo build consisted of some of these items instead of a Warmong's Armor or Frozen Mallet
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by The Overmyynd » August 29, 2012 4:16pm | Report
Buy a ward, save a life. EVERYONE should be buying wards all game.

GP10 items are very common on supports, since they don't get CS at all.

Lots of tanky junglers also grab gp10 items to increase their jungle sustain and give them lategame advantage.

Other than that, some tops do, ( Olaf almost ALWAYS grabs an early Heart of Gold)and occasionally a mid will grab kage's lucky pick if they want some early damage and late game power. Its nice that it also builds into a Deathfire Grasp for mid to late game massive combo damage.

Avarice Blade is a really good item on Gangplank, because he runs crit.
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by Kazega » August 29, 2012 6:13pm | Report
My theory on Supports works as follows:

It really depends on what your support is designed to do in terms of buffing and debuffing. A buffing Support like Sona, Janna, and Soraka that is designed to stay behind the team and away from should use itmes that buff the team like Shurelya's Reverie, Locket of the Iron Solari and Aegis of the Legion. A debuffing, or CC, Support like Alistar, Leona and Nautilus should use debuffing items like Randuin's Omen, Sunfire Cape and Frozen Heart because their design is to be closer to the enemies than the rest of the team.

As always, GP10 items are vital to supports either way, which makes Heart of Gold a vital item because it builds into both a buffing and debuffing item.
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by lifebaka » August 29, 2012 8:05pm | Report
Personally, I like to build Randuin's on both Sona and Soraka, due to their short range. Both like to get knee deep in teamfights to use their Qs for damage, and Sona likes to use her passive on high-priority targets. I also find that many teams will target me, the support, first, because I'm supposed to be squishy. It's not bad on Janna, either, if you plan on diving into the middle of fights to use your ult; plus it makes her even more impossible to chase.

I also build Shurelya's on all of those champions, because even on "debuffing"-type supports it's a great tool for quicker initiations, better chases, and better escapes.

I wouldn't get Sunfire Cape on any of those champions. As supports, they're too gold-starved to be able to afford a low-cost-efficiency items like Sunfire. Assuming they built its components, they'd be better off finishing them into Randuin's and a Warmogg's (or fromal, depending on how the game is going).
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by JEFFY40HANDS » August 29, 2012 8:20pm | Report
Supports are typically champions that present more utility than damage in team comps. Their role is to essentially baby sit the ADC and make sure they do well and don't lose their lane. To accomplish this they sacrifice farm, to supplement the lack of farm, they get GP10s. Other champions often do extremely well when itemized. And or provide more damage than utility. Off the top of my head Irelia and Vladimir fit my description of "poor supports". They are champions you want to have farm and to have kills, that way they can carry late game.

/thread.
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by DaRealWario » September 5, 2012 3:05pm | Report
Playing as Sona or Soraka, as much as I know they are Supports, I like to build as much AP as possible while maintaining the role. Their heals need it, and their one offensive spell needs it.
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by lifebaka » September 5, 2012 4:04pm | Report

Playing as Sona or Soraka, as much as I know they are Supports, I like to build as much AP as possible while maintaining the role. Their heals need it, and their one offensive spell needs it.

The trouble with this is that, as a support, you can't really afford to buy much in the way of AP. I mean, sure, you could get a Deathcap. Or you could finish Shurelya's and build an Aegis. (This isn't to say that supports should never build any AP, just that it's rarely worth it. In SuperlongTM games, I like to build Rylai's on Soraka.)

Besides that, you're aware that both Sona and Soraka have really bad ratios on their heals, right? They're mainly useful for actual healing during the laning phase, where they can be used to sustain between trades. Once teamfights start, the resistances attached to those heals are much more important than any amount of healing they could provide. Soraka's heals aren't good because they're heals. They're good because one has a 105 armor buff, and the other is a global heal. Sona's heal isn't good because it's a heal, Sona's heal is good because it's 15 armor and MR to the team. Note that none of these effects really scale with AP.

The same goes for their damage spells. Sona's Q is good because it gives her team bonus AD and AP, it can be spammed for good poke in lane, and it doubles the damage of her passive for additional poke (note that her passive doesn't scale with AP at all). Sona's ult is good because it's a huge AoE stun. Soraka's Q is good because it stacks MR reduction on the entire enemy team. Soraka's E is good because it's a long silence. Again, note that none of these effects scale with AP.

So, no. Supports don't really need AP. Their skills are awesome and amazing and great regardless of how big the numbers on them are, and the most important parts of those skills don't actually scale with AP. If you want to build your supports with AP, I'd suggest running them mid lane instead of as supports.
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by TheJohn » September 5, 2012 5:11pm | Report
Kazega wrote:

My theory on Supports works as follows:

It really depends on what your support is designed to do in terms of buffing and debuffing. A buffing Support like Sona, Janna, and Soraka that is designed to stay behind the team and away from should use itmes that buff the team like Shurelya's Reverie, Locket of the Iron Solari and Aegis of the Legion. A debuffing, or CC, Support like Alistar, Leona and Nautilus should use debuffing items like Randuin's Omen, Sunfire Cape and Frozen Heart because their design is to be closer to the enemies than the rest of the team.

As always, GP10 items are vital to supports either way, which makes Heart of Gold a vital item because it builds into both a buffing and debuffing item.


Your theory is really good

Agreed. I think both Philosopher's Stone and Heart of Gold are a must on supports
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