A Flash Free Season Three!

[quote=GrandmasterD][quote=Hyogetaki Hisame] [quote=Darcurse] - Its kinda ****ing arrogant to come up with stuff like "Flash counters Flash", "Plan = Plan even if Flash is a neccesity", etc. when multiple ppl already said that THIS is part of the problem. You definitely can have an opinion that it's not, but simply scrubbing that argument of like it never existed... where is the worth arguing with a brickwall? Take MyRepublic's example: Noone here from the "Everything's fine" fraction doesn't see any kind of problem with Flash being the only tool in the whole game that can save his sorry ass at this point? Many already said that normally you can't do this because of wards/careful enemies... so that means you guys admit that Flash roflstomps good enemies? Nice... rly. [/quote] If Flash saves both my sorry ass in a bad situation and my opponent in the same bad situation, then I'm perfectly fine with that, since we're even. [/quote] [b]This[/b] is exactly Darcurse's point. You are pretty much forced to take [[Flash]] because it is such a powerful spell and that is just weird.[/quote]

[quote=FalseoGod]Also, how many times have you had a gank from your jungler who happily went back to the jungle after writing "flash down" or you yourself write it so that the jungler can take that into consideration?[/quote]

[quote=koksei]oh - just to show you that it's a bit dumb to do this, at least while others are still available to do so, you should ask bitpik, even with flash you can't do shit but .. well if you won't have it I can do it even while mine is on CD. WW --> Flashult --> insta death mid, we did that in some games in a row .. was retarded lol[/quote]

[quote=Shuru]I'm surprised this thread went so long. I see a lot of stuff about getting rid of flash (making the meta cry), changing flashes mechanics (making the meta cry), changing its range again (making it worthless: IE making the meta cry) and overall making the meta cry. To make a point i want to look at some champions. point A: [[Galio]] Galio wants to use his ult, but every time he walks into a team and tries to pop his ult, [[elise]] hits him with cocoon, then ammumu with bandage toss, and here comes vayne with the condemn and alistar with pulverise before he can get in range to get more than their malphite in range, and while galios out everyone zones in on the enemy team and wins the 5-4 exchange. Solution? flash. Flash is fast enough for Galio to get in and use his ultimate before the train of CC can hit him, getting all 5 enemies in his ultimate lets his friendly Malphite keep everyone in line shortly after. point B: [[Sivir]] Sivir wants to run but as soon as she pops her ultimate vayne tumbles and condemns her into a wall. She comes out with 200 HP and nowhere to run. she dies shortly after the stun comes off. Solution? As soon as the stun wears off she flashes the wall and escapes while her support gives vayne hell for making the move, sivir survives in a clutch save that would have otherwise been failed by someone who didn't understand flashes mechanics and the stun duration on Condemn. point C: anyone with a built-in [[flash]] You're vayne, you want to kill ezreal. He's running from you and he teleports over the wall. Well that sucks, what are you going to do? you miss a kill on this ezreal. Solution? check your map, is there anyone you can't account for? no? well you guessed it. flash after him! if you are sure you can get the kill on Ezreal (IE he doesn't have phage or Tforce) and he's low enough to take out with a condemn, I mean he just flashed into the jungle right? piece of cake. Now lets look at these three simple points. How many parts of these are at all noobish? Galio just didn't want to get CCed to death, what if his malphite used his ult in the last fight and it wasn't up? maybe they didn't have a way to initiate other than galio, and if they didn't the enemy team would clean up. So galio needed flash to do something. Sivir just wants to live, she didn't make any big mistake, she was by a wall she could flash over, in bottom late thats only by your tower or theirs. Maybe she wasn't making mistakes, and was just at her tower and needed to run. so she flashed over the wall after a condemn in a save that in any other situation woulda cost her her life. Vaynes just chasing ezreal, she knows where everyone is, they're all accounted for, what's the problem with chasing him if he doesn't have phage to kite?[/quote]

[quote=NicknameMy]Instead of [[Flash]] there could be a different summoner spell called "Dash". Every spell which is like [[flash]] will be reworked into a dash. And no dash should be able to go through walls. This would still give those cc-champs a way to get into teamfights but disable the problem of wallhopping and instant flashing.[/quote]

[quote=Shuru][quote=NicknameMy] Instead of [[Flash]] there could be a different summoner spell called "Dash". Every spell which is like [[flash]] will be reworked into a dash. And no dash should be able to go through walls. This would still give those cc-champs a way to get into teamfights but disable the problem of wallhopping and instant flashing. [/quote] problem is for a lot of champions flashing over a wall is thier only escape, and anything else they can do is shut down by exhaust. Like [[sivir]] whose ultimate doesnt really help if she gets exhausted.[/quote]

[quote=Lugignaf][quote=NicknameMy] Instead of [[Flash]] there could be a different summoner spell called "Dash". Every spell which is like [[flash]] will be reworked into a dash. And no dash should be able to go through walls. This would still give those cc-champs a way to get into teamfights but disable the problem of wallhopping and instant flashing. [/quote] What's that? You want to create less opportunity for plays? Great idea! I'll just tell Lee Sin he's worthless as a jungler now as well as Ezreal being knocked back to near-uselessness. Kat can't save herself because you're not allowed to shunpo through walls anymore? I guess she's kinda terrible now too. You can't turn flashes into dashes. It changes the entire mechanic of the champion.[/quote]

[quote=Fox Rage]I never liked the summoner spell system, and will never like it. Riot should've made more items with active, wich would've replaced summoner spells (like Blink Dagger in dota2 for exemple). I just don't feel like summoner spells in general have their place in MOBAs.[/quote]

[quote=XeresAce]The meta revolves around flash, would be interesting to see how it would go without it tbh :3 BUT, id definitely miss having a free out of jail free card, or at-least some mobility on ashe or varus. Heck, without it playing galio/sona/ heck even amumu would be a pain in the ass :3[/quote]

[quote=GrandmasterD][quote=FalseoGod] Also, how many times have you had a gank from your jungler who happily went back to the jungle after writing "flash down" or you yourself write it so that the jungler can take that into consideration? [/quote] and then he never comes back.. LOL! But well, I'm unsure what your point here is; that if we won't have [[Flash]] that we can't have that anymore? Being a jungler is 80% presence if not more. Ganking is just for presence and sometimes you can get kills of it but mostly to show them you are lurking in the dark.[/quote]