Let's Talk Shen

[quote=BluAnimal]Hey everybody. Currently I'm a Gold I [[shen]] player. I wanted to discuss a few things and hopefully get some feedback from other Shen players. Today I decided to touch up/clean up/tweak some of my rune pages and mastery pages. Everything seemed fine and I decided to click my Shen page just to see if I could move a point around to get a little more something. Anyways, upon clicking it I was greeted with this. [img=http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/1393/ngq.png] As far as I know, and I haven't touched the page for the past 30-40 days, I have been running Shen with 21/9/0 masteries. I wasn't aware of this at all, and thinking back now, it would explain a lot of my extreme early game burst. At the same time I was incredibly tanky because I rush [[sunfire cape]] and typical Shen items. This really threw me off because in my mind I would have set him up 9/21/0, but for whatever reason, when I made the Shen page I set it up 21/9/0. It is exactly identical to my [[jax]] offense page. Despite this odd set up, I have been winning the vast majority of my Shen games and dominating in lane. I couldn't decide whether to change it up or no, but I've decided to leave it as it is, 21/9/0, because I'm finding great success with it. Maybe it's because I'm only in Gold and most people don't bother to target Shen because OMG HES THE TANK@@@. With that said, should I change them at all? How do you guys have Shen set up? Secondly, my Shen build is typically something along the lines of: Start: [[elixir of fortitude]] and [[health potion]]s OR [[rejuvenation bead]] and [[health potion]]s OR [[boots of speed]] and [[health potion]]s. I then aim for a [[sunfire cape]] as soon as possible, and if all is going in my favor and no enemies are giving me a rough time I will then build a [[blade of the ruined king]] next. This is something I haven't seen a single other Shen player in my ELO or in the pro scene or at high ELO (I watch a ton of top lane streams). It seems like a pretty sound item. It has attack speed, it gives him a unique passive that will let him deal noticeable damage and it gives him sustain. It seems like a great item for split pushing and it also has a pretty good effect on enemies during teamfights. I haven't seen any issues with it when I'm ahead and it's become standard in my build. I feel it is superior to both [[statik shiv]] and [[wit's end]] which are the "common" backdoor items. So yeah. To wrap this up, what are your thoughts on [[Blade of the ruined king]] on [[shen]], as well as the 21/9/0 mastery set up? Thank you for reading, everyone.[/quote]

[quote=luizdeh]I think fort pot explains your early burst better than offensive masteries. Masteries are fine imo, no problem getting that extra damage as long as back it up with defensive items, because you are still front line, regardless of what you build. I don't like BotRK on [[shen]]. First and foremost because the active isn't put to its best use, because of your dash. Second because you can do more damage going with tanky items that sinergize with your abilities, like the aforementioned [[sunfire cape]] and [[wit's end]], easily one the combos I like most in-game.[/quote]

[quote=Joshified]I personally run ad marks on [[Shen]] to help his early game and I never seem to lose lane. I build [[Sunfire cape]] first in like 99% of matches. I also like to purchase an early [[kage's lucky pick]] which I build into a [[twin shadows]] later on. Other items I buy are usually [[Warmog's armor]] and [[Randuin's omen]]. If the game STILL goes on after that I will buy an offensive item like [[trinity force]], [[wit's end]] or [[blade of the ruined king]]. That is assuming our team is lacking damage.. Otherwise you can never go wrong with [[Guardian angel]]..[/quote]

[quote=PsiGuard]Your last six points in offense are practically worthless since you aren't going to be building AP items. You can run dual pen if you want, but throw the rest of those points into defense. I still think 21 defense is probably a better idea simply because it scales really well with defensive builds.[/quote]

[quote=A Chubby Baby]REJUVENATION BEAD START FTW.[/quote]

[quote=utopus]Yeah shen has a really really strong level 2. I see lots of shens try and do an all-in type move - even against some of his counters like Kayle and Elise. While shen doesn't always kill the person in his level 2 gib, Shens that do that at least get an early game with a little less pressure. With that in mind, running 21/9/0 masteries is fine, if that's what you plan to do. Tbh, i don't think BorK is necessary. [[sunfire cape]] is already an excellent splitpushing item, and that item's really part of shen's core. I'd much rather just go for the [[runic bulwark]] to give your team extra utility. Maybe if you're really fed, getting a Frozen Fist wouldn't be a bad idea either. Thoughts? EDIT: I think getting Bork is ok if youre really fed and don't mind going HAM on your opponents carries.[/quote]

[quote=BluAnimal][quote=luizdeh] I think fort pot explains your early burst better than offensive masteries. Masteries are fine imo, no problem getting that extra damage as long as back it up with defensive items, because you are still front line, regardless of what you build. I don't like BotRK on [[shen]]. First and foremost because the active isn't put to its best use, because of your dash. Second because you can do more damage going with tanky items that sinergize with your abilities, like the aforementioned [[sunfire cape]] and [[wit's end]], easily one the combos I like most in-game. [/quote] I don't see the issue with BoRK. It gives you identical attack speed to [[wit's end]] while also giving you that passive which is helpful for closing a gap when [[shadow dash]] is on cool down. I don't know if it's a personal problem but I find split pushing with [[sunfire cape]] alone to be rather slow. [quote=PsiGuard] Your last six points in offense are practically worthless since you aren't going to be building AP items. You can run dual pen if you want, but throw the rest of those points into defense. I still think 21 defense is probably a better idea simply because it scales really well with defensive builds. [/quote] Agreed. Shortly after posting this I realized it was a waste since I don't build any AP on him and moved them into the Armor Pen. and flat AD. Both of which will help with trades and early farming.[/quote]

[quote=Arcana3]Wits end new passive with sunfire cap, makes the combo better. Botrk is more for assassins/adcs, that use lifesteal much more. Wits end gives you tankiness, a passive that works with sunfire, and attack speed. If i had to decide between the two i would choose wits. You wont be getting a ton of aa with shen.[/quote]

[quote=samgoeslol]wits end is amazing with sunfire while adding resistances AND IT IS CHEAP. botrk has no defensive stats and is fairly expensive (lifesteal isnt all that good with a hpstacking tank). If you want more dmg as shen id suggest wits end, sunfire, triforce, botrk (its good but as most purely offensive items unviable when not far ahead) or THORNMAIL (thorn is amazing for endgame fights) my usual build is 9 21 0 hybpen reds mpen mastery. sunfire, wits, mercs, randuins, spirit visage/warmogs, thornmail. thorn is amazing vs physical and i like the armorheavy build for massive turretdiving via flashtaunt (or tauntflash xD). in higher lvls of play you will see that building dmg is not as strong as tankiness imo. 1 offensive item is okay but botrk is sooooo expensive for an early pickup while triforce has great parts to build of and stack some def inbetween. even without "real" dmgitems, shen already shreds backliners ;) greez sam[/quote]

[quote=Embracing]sunfire botrk is like core on shen just watch ogn :P[/quote]