Malady and Madred's Bloodrazor, two useless items

[quote=Icuonuez][quote=DaRealWario] All of my first 3 [[Udyr]] matches were successful because of this item being in the build. It doesn't need any altering :P [/quote] I went AD jungle Lulu and was successful. Just because you can do something doesn't mean it's good. I would be iffy about changing the percentages on Madred's. However, I feel it could use a bit more AD and a reduced cost.[/quote]

[quote=NicknameMy]Then, as already said, create 2 bloodrazor's, 1 for AD and 1 for on-hit. Would solve all problems at once.[/quote]

[quote=b3astliness]Percentage wise I feel Madred's to be enough I would Say Buff AD to 50 and AS to %50 would be nice. 2 different madreds is also not a bad idea.[/quote]

[quote=tehAsian]Tbh, I'd just change the recipe so that it would give more armor, and add 1% to the on-hit portion. Maybe a 5% buff to AS. According to Xen, it seems it doesn't give enough bulk with only comparable damage to way cheaper items, which makes it unattractive to buy.[/quote]

[quote=Chaotic Bliss]Ok so let me get this straight... You think that these items are useless and need some kinda buff? Ok its time for me to give my slightly chaotic opinion about this. [[malady]] is a cheap item to make, and IMO I think its a viable early game item. The things that this does is meant for early game play. Low on-hit dmg and MR shred at lower lvls are highly effective. On hit champs like [[teemo]], make great use of this item since it will increase magic dmg done. Not just by him, but by other champs that deal magical dmg. That said, it has the potential to benefit the mages of your team. Also, many players in early game will be too worried about getting MR, unless its [[galio]] or other various tanks or supports. Most players will try to get those items that benefit their champs early game, than build defenses. And Id like to point out, that if you can manage to get the 4 stacks off [[malady]], than you have shredded the MR given by [[null-magic mantle]]. This brings them down to their base MR making the mantle a worthless item. So early MR in the mantle is a waste of gold. Seeing as how I see this as an early game item, and you cant see that, Im sry to say that you still have some learning to do. [[madred's bloodrazor]] might be an expensive item to build, but if itemized at the right time, it be worth the gold. You are right to say MR counters the on-hit effect, but I would bet that most players would by more armor than MR when faced with an AD carry. And unless you are playing against people that have a fair balance of armor and MR, I dont see an issue with this item. Off-Tanks like [[udyr]], can make this item a dangerous thing. Also, champs that can prioritize AS or are great kiters, [[ashe]], [[teemo]], [[vayne]], also make this item nasty. Its not suppose to be a balanced dmg/survival item. IMO, this item should only be used on champs that are tanky enough to take a beating, or are standing far away enough to stay out of harms way. These items have a time and place for them to be used. I know that they seem lack-luster at best, but you have to get them at the right times on the right champs. Apparently you have learned these things yet.[/quote]

[quote=Luther3000][quote=Chaotic Bliss] Also, many players in early game will be too worried about getting MR, unless its [[galio]] or other various tanks or supports. Most players will try to get those items that benefit their champs early game, than build defenses. And Id like to point out, that if you can manage to get the 4 stacks off [[malady]], than you have shredded the MR given by [[null-magic mantle]]. This brings them down to their base MR making the mantle a worthless item. So early MR in the mantle is a waste of gold. [/quote] Your logic in this argument is flawed. If they didn't have the Null-Magic Mantle they would have lost the same amount of MR - in fact, it would have had a [i]greater[/i] effect because of the diminishing returns of higher magic resist. It's like saying [[brutalizer]] makes [[cloth armor]] worthless, it doesn't, in fact it's quite the opposite. Flat pen is always more effective on targets with very low amounts of that resistance, assuming you don't take them further than zero. This is why Magic Pen reds and [[sorcerer's shoes]] is such a potent combination, because it adds up to 28.55 Mpen and the base magic resist of all champions is 30, meaning you deal almost true damage to anyone who didn't invest in MR. Later in the game when people have MR, the pen from your runes and shoes becomes much less valuable because the % of damage reduced changes much less. It's also fairly common for people to build early resistances or take runes to counter their lane opponent, particularly in top lane.[/quote]

[quote=samgoeslol]malady is a good item on teemo and maybe kayle, but unfortunately thats where it stops. Teemo can develop great lanepressure with malady and lategame it is a core item. as for bloodrazor, its an extremely good onhit item (as far as onhit items go excluding wits) greez sam[/quote]

[quote=Embracing]25% of Madred's damage goes away with 30 Mr which is a champ's base MR. Spending 3800 on something that's easily countered by something less than 1k gold? waste of money[/quote]

[quote=Darcurse][quote=NicknameMy] If you just want to flame and not theory craft, go to the official bugged QQ-Thread. [/quote] If YOU would actually try to use the right forum it would be much appreciated. There is sth called "Champion&Item ideas" go there with those "reworks" of yours, since they got NOTHING to do with Theory Crafting.[/quote]

[quote=NicknameMy]Reworks are basically theory crafting about how to change something so that it is better. And this thread was started to find out why [[madred's bloodrazor]] and [[malady]] aren't viable and theory craft about how to fix that. TT: Yes, [[teemo]] and [[kayle]] are already good with [[malady]], but a change to it with armor, higher shredd and more magic damage on-hit would fit to them very well. And the little AP is for them more or less wasted anyway. It would be a bit more expensive, but that balances out how powerfull it would be for them. Especially on top lane if you want to counter a physical damage enemy.[/quote]