I want to be a Blitzball wrote:
TSM is a lost cause
I love you, unless Bjerg finally put the carry pants, I doubt they'll ever get past groups.
CLG could show us some good fights, but won't win imo
I'm happy that C9 sent Piglet back home. But Lemon should really stop playing Karma almost exclusively xD
I'm not sure if you just hate EU or are a complete ****** when it comes to the competitive scene.
CLG might make it past groups, seeing how they don't look terrible. TSM sucks. Sadly Gravity and Liquid weren't good enough to trash TSM and stop them from going to Worlds. C9 could surprise with some luck, at best. Unless they get a super easy group, which should be impossible considering how the groups are built.
Fnatic is the strongest western team EVER. If you can't see that you should maybe stop even watching League. H2K clearly have the ability to perform. They're good at macro, and have decent to good players in all roles. Origen is the opposite. They got the raw skill, but lack in ability to perform consistently, as shown by Roccat and UoL.
TSM would get absolutely destroyed by Fnatic. They would most likely lose to H2K and Origen as well. AHQ would also win. Oh, let's not forget SKT, LGD, KOO and whichever other Asian teams would send them home crying.
And seeing how you believe C9 to be so good, why did they suck during the first half of the split? Right, they changed a single player. Fnatic are two time champs and they had to rebuild completely. C9 certainly are good, but not on a level where they can challenge for anything higher than top 8, at best. I would like seeing them perform, especially after their gauntlet run, but at least I know when it's a good train to jump on. You clearly missed the Fnatic train, or the SKT/LGD train.
CLG might make it past groups, seeing how they don't look terrible. TSM sucks. Sadly Gravity and Liquid weren't good enough to trash TSM and stop them from going to Worlds. C9 could surprise with some luck, at best. Unless they get a super easy group, which should be impossible considering how the groups are built.
Fnatic is the strongest western team EVER. If you can't see that you should maybe stop even watching League. H2K clearly have the ability to perform. They're good at macro, and have decent to good players in all roles. Origen is the opposite. They got the raw skill, but lack in ability to perform consistently, as shown by Roccat and UoL.
TSM would get absolutely destroyed by Fnatic. They would most likely lose to H2K and Origen as well. AHQ would also win. Oh, let's not forget SKT, LGD, KOO and whichever other Asian teams would send them home crying.
And seeing how you believe C9 to be so good, why did they suck during the first half of the split? Right, they changed a single player. Fnatic are two time champs and they had to rebuild completely. C9 certainly are good, but not on a level where they can challenge for anything higher than top 8, at best. I would like seeing them perform, especially after their gauntlet run, but at least I know when it's a good train to jump on. You clearly missed the Fnatic train, or the SKT/LGD train.
Thanks to The_Nameless_Bard for the sig!
Lol yeah
Aside from that, both sides (by this I mean EU and NA ppl) sway too far to one side and away from an objective view. I had a discussion with a couple of friends about some kind of 'power ranking' and basically we concluded this is going to be the best worlds ever in terms of the overall level of the teams participating.
While we don't know how the teams will stack up for now, we can use the MSI results for some kind of comparison. I'm expecting Fnatic to be even stronger than before and possibly be a contender for the #1 spot, together with LGD, SKT and the #2 from China. Everything below this top-4 is going to be extremely hard to predict.
CLG is impossible to predict, they can join the top-4 but can also drop games to the lowest ranked teams (except IWC teams unless they pull off a Kabum). We haven't seen them on the international scene for so long it's just too hard to call. In general, I'm expecting them to fall short for the top spots but give the top teams a good run for their money regardless. TSM isn't **** like some people claim them to be. Their lower rankings during the split isn't a case of them getting worse, it's them stagnating and the rest of the NA scene actually improving. They can make it out of groups if they have a decent draw but probably won't make a huge impact going into the knock-out phase of the tournament. C9 will probably drop out in groups unless they get a really good draw (keep in mind that there's a 67% chance they draw either LGD or SKT). They're probably in the same state as TSM (meaning: a decent team but not good enough to cause upsets).
Looking at the other teams in EU, Origen would definitely be able to cause some upsets but they're seeded in pot 3, while H2k probably lacks behind but is placed in pot 2. Therefore I'm not expecting either to make it out of groups, of course unless they get a lucky draw.
I'm expecting AHQ and Yoe Flash Wolves to sit somewhere between the likes of TSM and C9/Fnatic. AHQ will probably make it out of groups and the Flash Wolves can make an upset if they get seeded with some of the weaker EU/NA teams.
In short: here is my tier list:
Favourites (Will contend for #1): LGD, SKT, Fnatic, #2 China
Sub-top (Will make it out of groups unless really poor draw and may contest top spots): CLG, #3 China, Koo Tigers, AHQ
Underdogs (Probably won't make it out of groups): Origen, Flash Wolves, TSM, #3 Korea, H2k, C9
Wildcard: IWC teams
While writing this, I actually feel like I'm overrating Koo Tigers but it feels so weird to have all but one KR teams in the underdogs position.
Aside from that, both sides (by this I mean EU and NA ppl) sway too far to one side and away from an objective view. I had a discussion with a couple of friends about some kind of 'power ranking' and basically we concluded this is going to be the best worlds ever in terms of the overall level of the teams participating.
While we don't know how the teams will stack up for now, we can use the MSI results for some kind of comparison. I'm expecting Fnatic to be even stronger than before and possibly be a contender for the #1 spot, together with LGD, SKT and the #2 from China. Everything below this top-4 is going to be extremely hard to predict.
CLG is impossible to predict, they can join the top-4 but can also drop games to the lowest ranked teams (except IWC teams unless they pull off a Kabum). We haven't seen them on the international scene for so long it's just too hard to call. In general, I'm expecting them to fall short for the top spots but give the top teams a good run for their money regardless. TSM isn't **** like some people claim them to be. Their lower rankings during the split isn't a case of them getting worse, it's them stagnating and the rest of the NA scene actually improving. They can make it out of groups if they have a decent draw but probably won't make a huge impact going into the knock-out phase of the tournament. C9 will probably drop out in groups unless they get a really good draw (keep in mind that there's a 67% chance they draw either LGD or SKT). They're probably in the same state as TSM (meaning: a decent team but not good enough to cause upsets).
Looking at the other teams in EU, Origen would definitely be able to cause some upsets but they're seeded in pot 3, while H2k probably lacks behind but is placed in pot 2. Therefore I'm not expecting either to make it out of groups, of course unless they get a lucky draw.
I'm expecting AHQ and Yoe Flash Wolves to sit somewhere between the likes of TSM and C9/Fnatic. AHQ will probably make it out of groups and the Flash Wolves can make an upset if they get seeded with some of the weaker EU/NA teams.
In short: here is my tier list:
Favourites (Will contend for #1): LGD, SKT, Fnatic, #2 China
Sub-top (Will make it out of groups unless really poor draw and may contest top spots): CLG, #3 China, Koo Tigers, AHQ
Underdogs (Probably won't make it out of groups): Origen, Flash Wolves, TSM, #3 Korea, H2k, C9
Wildcard: IWC teams
While writing this, I actually feel like I'm overrating Koo Tigers but it feels so weird to have all but one KR teams in the underdogs position.
Luther3000 wrote:
Spoiler alert: it's not just when it comes to the competitive scene.
I think that's more of his ego being the biggest in the world, unable to comprehend that he's bad. Here it's just him being unable to see that NA isn't good.
On point of NA not being good, when did they last perform at Worlds?
Season 1: 3rd,4th and 5th. Not counting since LoL wasn't far yet at such a level.
Season 2: TSM finished 5th-8th through a draw. Lost 0-2 to Azubu Frost.
Season 3: C9 finishing 5th-8th because of getting a top 4 finish at All-Stars. 1-2 to FNC. (TSM finished 4th in their group.)
Season 4: TSM and C9 finishing 2nd in their groups. But then came the Samsung nation. Both finished 5th-8th.
CLG is the only NA team who I feel like can get out of groups, as long they don't get really unlucky with their groups. C9 would need a miracle draw to get out. TSM can't be saved.
Edit: Maybe TSM can be saved. Still, I think they're clearly weaker than most teams. They can be good, but it just doesn't happen often. Also, if the #3 Korean seed is Najin I think they can finish top 4. Najin is easily one of the best teams in the World the few times they play as a team. SKT struggled beating them, and Najin clearly performed well.
My own tier list:
Favorites: SKT, LGD, #2 China, #3 China if it's IG, #3 Korean if it's Najin, Fnatic.
High performers: #3 Korea if it's CJ or KT, AHQ, #2 or #3 China if it's EDG.
Not gonna comment on the rest seeing how we either know too little, or they're inconsistent (KOO).
Thanks to The_Nameless_Bard for the sig!
I don't think origen is being that inconsistent. I thought roccat was a better team than UOL so I'm not surprised to see origen have a better record against UOL than roccat. I didn't expect a sweep, I wanted to see UOL win but I'm not too surprised either way.
Signature is from Ninja_Trigger's champion mastery thread!
New and slightly improved version is still up to date >HERE!<
I want to compare Origen to Najin, but that would be an insult to Najin. Both teams have a lineup full of talent and are highly inconsistent. If they do pull themselves together, then they look like a top team. The difference is that Origen doesn't know what to do more often than not, and that Najin will look like one of the best teams in the world at their peak, probably worse than Origen at their worst.
Thanks to The_Nameless_Bard for the sig!
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