oh btw dude i figured something out, going a hybrid of phoenix and tiger can work, like making your bear only level 3 and doing tiger turtle and phoenix level 5

If you are to make like a dps build that conserves of ap i think he could do a hybrid build, i would try it, but gettting phoenix out then popping to tiger did loadsa damage :D

Yeah in fact i often do this to, but if found out that it is more easy to gank with bear and phoenix than it is with tiger, cause you have thesame effect as the sunfire cape...even when you dont get to hit them you do damage. BUt yeah you are perfectly considering the tower pushing qualities. they are much better if you have skilled Tiger to.

thx for reply

i would suggest gettin a point in tiger a lil earlier and lvling udyr pheonix with only 3 points and maxing it at the end this will maximise ur overall dmg output and improve ur ganks etc also gives u a lil more turret pushing earlier on which allows u to really put the hurt on the enemy after a successful gank other than that its a gd guide

hey man, this is a fine build, a thumbs up ^^, go check my Phoenix Udyr guide, and tell me what you think!