Thank you for sharing your thoughts of my guide!

The reason I think armor is better in this particular Veigar build, is that I will be building a lot of hp already, and not that much resistance. At the end of the game I will have built 1150 hp from items and I will get some extra from my masteries. I feel that this makes the armor seals a much better alternative since I won't be building armor until pretty far into the game. Also, when I have around 3k hp, the 215 hp from the runes will not make that big of a difference. Atleast that's how I feel about it.

The reason I used the icon + bright yellow text was that if I showed it This way: Veigar then the icon was really small and hard to see (although thinking about it, I have a pretty small screen so it might look bigger for the average person) and I wanted it to be clearer. When I looked through it I didn't feel like the brightness hurt my eyes but you make a really good point and I realize I might have gone overboard with the bright colors. I will reduce them a bit.

The reason Void Staff isn't in the core items was that I feel like the other items are more important than it is. But if you check out the item section you will see that I have Void Staff recommended if several enemies are buying MR.

Lastly, about Randuin's Omen. I feel like you missed the whole point of my guide. Yes, switching out Randuin's for a zhonyas would give me more damage, but it would also make me more vulnerable. The point of my guide was to chow people a way to build Veigar tanky, but still able to burst down the most important targets in a teamfight, then survive a bit longer to keep cc'ing the enemy. Randuins makes you incredibly tanky vs ad champions and also a bit vs ap (because hp). It not only gives you armor and hp, but it also slows down the enemies attack speed. All in all, I feel like this is the best tank item in the game. Since we are not building many tanky items, we need them to be strong ones, and that's why I use randuin's.

If you do not like the idea of a tanky Veigar then this guide is not for you.

Lastly, I would like to thank you again for your thoughts on my guide. You helped me see that COLORS EVERYWHERE isn't good at all. I'll try to keep them down from now on, I guess I did it because i thought it would make it more interesting to read. Have a good day :D

Really nice job on this guide so far! However, when looking over the guide I spotted a couple things that I think could be improved on:

Instead of getting armor, you should definitely consider taking Greater Seal of Health or Greater Seal of Scaling Health instead. This is because with the nerf of Armor seals, all champions were given a free 4 armor by Riot. Taking Health instead will increase the effectiveness of that armor exponentially, compared to the linear effectiveness of more armor.

Why do you use an icon + the name of the item/champion/ability in bright yellow? The brightness of it really hurts my eyes when I'm reading your guide. Especially if you mix in a whole bunch of other colors as well such as in this section... There's really no need to make every "AP" purple and every "Mana" cyan and every "Health" bright red. Sometimes, simpler is better :) The way you currently have all the colors is very distracting, and is actually counterproductive to the real reason as to using BBCode, which is to draw the reader's attention and maintain it. With all of the varying shades, it becomes extremely hard to focus on the text.

For example, in the above paragraph, I highlighted a single sentence in bright green, signifying that that sentence was the major point in that explanation. Simple things like that will actually let you get your point across much more easily than if you try to throw too many things at once at the reader.

Regarding the build itself, why isn't Void Staff in the core items? :( If the enemy even builds 30 MR, not counting base magic resist, your entire combo wouldn't even kill the ADC. Your magic pen from runes/masteries will only take you past early game, and won't help very much late game.

Also, Randuin's Omen is a terrible item on APCs o_o It doesn't provide you with damage (which is Veigar's main selling point, nuking the enemy APC/ADC in .01 seconds by pressing R), and the extra armor and health isn't necessary since you are one of the people the tanks/support on your team should be protecting. If you need armor, Zhonya's Hourglass is the way to go, because it adds a huge power spike to your abilities as well as an active that can let your team come to your aid if you ever get caught.

Fix these things, and you'll have my upvote :)

Thank you for your comment Foxy Riven! I'm really glad that the first comment was one with suggestions and reasons and not just someone saying my guide is bad.

I thought that i had removed Sunfire Aegis already, apparently not :p but you are right, you don't want to be near enemies preffereably. I originally added it as a cheaper alternative to Randuin's Omen but i realized that it wouldn't be that good at all. I will proceed to remove it now.

I will add an upgraded trinket and enchanted boots into my core build.

I will add a small column between runes and explanation.

I added armor marks as an alternative to magic pen marks but said that magic pen marks were almost always better, but i feel like they are viable. They are pretty much as good as armor seals although we do loose a fair bit of damage. Why do you feel like armor marks are always bad?

I really do like scaling armor better than flat armor. It is a bit more difficult the first levels but already at lvl 6 they are stronger so i feel it's worth it. Also, Veigar has a really good stun to escape early ganks (and it should always be available since we don't use it early game) so I don't feel like ganks are that much of a problem at all.

As for glyphs, yes, the enemy mage will try to kill me before lvl 6 and several times before lvl 9 where my scaling glyphs become as strong as the flat ones, but usually we will be standing as close to our turret as possible so we can just stun and run to tower if they try to engage (stunning may be difficult vs Kassadin, LeBlanc :p) and i think the late game power they give us is well worth the more defensive aproach we have to take in lane phase.

Also THANK YOU for the coding advice! I really do appreciate it. Columns are pretty annoying to use and i'm glad there are other ways to do stuff. I will definately use the spoiler naming code too.

Thanks again for your comment, I really do appreciate it.
Ps. I changed the special thanks section to say "her" instead of "his" on jhoi's works, i had no idea.

(Jhoi is a girl)

I like the idea of making him tanky to some extent. But you still don't want to be in the middle of teamfights, that's why I feel Sunfire Aegis is not at all a good item on the midget. You don't talk about it in the item section anyway, just remove it from the cheat sheet:)

Try to add an upgraded trinket & enchanted boots in your core build.

Add a small column in between your rune icons & explanation. They stick together atm.

Rune choice: Never go armor marks.
For seal, it's better to get flat armor than scaling, because you'll need it a lot more in the early levels. Right now you'll get blown up when they gank you. Mixing them with flat health is good as well (5 health 4 armor) but not mandatory.

When laning against an AP champion, it's better to start flat magic resist glyphs. They WILL try to pick a fight with you before level 6. Especially LeBlanc.


For coding, you don't need to put titles in columns when you just want them to be in the middle.

For exampls Starting items. Just use this:

[center][size=6]Starting Items[/size][/center]



For spoilers, you can give those a name by adding =TITLE to the spoiler tag. Example:

[spoiler=Ability explanation]Text[/spoiler]


Good start though :)


Foxy