Should 3rd Party Apps be Allowed?

[quote=Alan LaFleur][columns] [indent] [nextcol] [center][size=7][color=#ff8000]Should 3rd Party Apps be Allowed?[/color][/size][/center] [center][size=5][color=#ffff00]Alan LaFleur | April 26th[/color][/size][/center] [center][url=http://forums.las.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=83611][img width=600]http://www.mobafire.com/images/news/3rdpartyapps.png[/img][/url][/center] A discussion sprang up yesterday as it came to the attention of the community that [url=http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/23y1wc/crs_voice_banned_from_laslan_servers/]Riot was banning players using a popular third party app[/url]. The manager of player experience in Latin America [url=http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/23y1wc/crs_voice_banned_from_laslan_servers/ch1r5xe]said[/url]: [quote]Hey guys, I am the manager for player experience in Latin America and in charge of player behavior for the region, I wanted to come in here and give some clarity on this issue. Our team is not actively going out of our way to ban players from using this application or other similar ones. We simply have communicated to players that we believe that any use of a third party application which provides them with a clear competitive advantage over other players should not be allowed. A few months ago after a different application that provided automatic timers was beginning to gain some popularity in our region, our ps team, the central ps team with their player behavior lead, and myself met up and decided that it was something we did not want to endorse in our region. We gave clear communication to players in the forums and after a few weeks we took action on a few players that actively continued to use this app on streams or in a few cases where we had ps tickets and could confirm the use of the app for a competitive advantage. I wanted to point out that this is a direction we decided to go in as a region months ago before this became a hot topic globally, we are simply maintaining our stance on the issue for the time being. This app is currently being discussed actively at Riot and a direction has not yet been suggested by the central Riot team yet. When that happens, as any region does, we'll decide what our next steps are. Riot always empowers each region to be player focused and make their own decisions to benefit you guys, and rest assured we'll continue to discuss this internally and adapt as things develop further. We want to make sure our players always have the best experience possible when playing League. Thanks [/quote] We want to know how you feel about the use of 3rd party apps! Do you think they should be allowed? Do you think Riot is doing the right thing by banning players that are using apps from big gaming companies? From a business perspective, is it fair to the company that spends the money to create an app like this only to have it killed by the developer? [nextcol] [indent] [/columns][/quote]

[quote=drakon136]I have no problem with Curse Voice (let's be honest this thread is about it), but I still think it shouldn't be allowed. Why? Because its existence will encourage the creation of other third-party programs that provide large advantages to players, but are still technically only giving them information they already have. For example, a program that keeps track of where enemies place wards.[/quote]

[quote=DillButt64]unless the company gets permission to create the app for the game then i -think- its perfectly fair for the developers to kill it either way i think some of them are fine if it gives you timers on things you saw (dragon/baron timers if you see them die) or information on your own teammates (CDs on their ults/exp bars) but if it tells you that information without you seeing it or giving you your enemies information then it shouldnt be allowed also programs that mechanically play the game for you shouldnt be allowed but thats kinda obvious[/quote]

[quote=GrandmasterD][quote=Alan LaFleur] From a business perspective, is it fair to the company that spends the money to create an app like this only to have it killed by the developer?[/quote] That's the risk of creating such a third party app, especially when it comes to a competitive game. Crs Voice does some stuff that isn't really possible to do as a player. If you're playing against a [[Skarner]] with X% CDR and has just used his ult, then you have no real idea when his [[Impale]] is going to be back up as a result of [[Energize]] (Also his CDR might be at a really odd percentage). Although Crs voice will tell you exactly when it is up, this is a major advantage. When it comes to basic jungle camp timers, I don't really mind as that's easy to do yourself. I mean if Riot would ban it because of that then they would also have to make sure no one has another person sitting next to them with ten stopwatches. Point is, if an App does something that exceeds the possibilities of humans then it becomes an (unfair) advantage so I'd say that Riot is definitely allowed to ban this. Although they need to ask themselves if it's time to actually introduce some of this stuff themselves.[/quote]

[quote=]It only shows team mates ult cooldowns timers is also just basic maths. Don't really see the issue.[/quote]

[quote=Luther3000][quote=GrandmasterD] Crs Voice does some stuff that isn't really possible to do as a player. If you're playing against a [[Skarner]] with X% CDR and has just used his ult, then you have no real idea when his [[Impale]] is going to be back up as a result of [[Energize]] (Also his CDR might be at a really odd percentage). Although Crs voice will tell you exactly when it is up, this is a major advantage. [/quote] It doesn't; it only tells you your own team's ult cooldowns and dragon + baron timers. Anyways I've been using it a bit but I also feel like it needs to be banned. Players using it have a measurable advantage over players who aren't using it. That said I do think at the very least the ultimate cooldowns (and possibly the dragon and baron timer too) should just be integrated into the game by Riot - I've never understood why the only information communicated to you about your team is a crappy green dot that bugs out with certain champions. As for the timers they're already in the game if you turn on timestamps, it just requires manually adding +6 or 7. Might as well just go all the way and put them up on the screen like Curse Voice does. Additionally, Riot's (except latin america) current working strategy of essentially allowing anything you could've figured out on your own could easily lead to a very slippery slope. Technically speaking it's absolutely possible to figure out an opponent's exact cooldowns, damages and ranges if you're aware of the base values, your opponents stats and you're a math god, so by that logic it'd be fine to have a program do it all for you. You could have it display an icon over opponents who you can kill in one combo/who can kill you in one combo, show their cooldowns and show their attack range and it's all absolutely fine under Riot's current stance. Hell, I'm sure a program like this already exists somewhere. Not to mention that all the streamers currently whoring themselves out with free beta keys for subscribers are really rustling my jimmies.[/quote]

[quote=GrandmasterD][quote=Luther3000] [quote=GrandmasterD] Crs Voice does some stuff that isn't really possible to do as a player. If you're playing against a [[Skarner]] with X% CDR and has just used his ult, then you have no real idea when his [[Impale]] is going to be back up as a result of [[Energize]] (Also his CDR might be at a really odd percentage). Although Crs voice will tell you exactly when it is up, this is a major advantage. [/quote] It doesn't; it only tells you your own team's ult cooldowns and dragon + baron timers. Anyways I've been using it a bit but I also feel like it needs to be banned. Players using it have a measurable advantage over players who aren't using it. That said I do think at the very least the ultimate cooldowns (and possibly the dragon and baron timer too) should just be integrated into the game by Riot - I've never understood why the only information communicated to you about your team is a crappy green dot that bugs out with certain champions. As for the timers they're already in the game if you turn on timestamps, it just requires manually adding +6 or 7. Might as well just go all the way and put them up on the screen like Curse Voice does. [/quote] Oh, I thought it showed enemy ult cool downs as well. Anyway, I think Riot needs to implement the stuff they have in the spectator mode. I want to see the cd of my allies' summoner's and their ultimate. Timers, especially baron and dragon should just be listed somewhere. In fact, it would be nice if I can actually find everything I need on the HuD (or not at all times and there's a hotkey to show it) and no longer be needing a chat.[/quote]

[quote=OTGBionicArm]Either yea, we should all get a fancy dragon/baron timer HuD thing. Or everyone should have to deal with the old fashioned "actually knowing how to do math omg i know right? hard stuff". Knowing the timers and using it to your advantage is part of the skill curve of league of legends and this 3rd party app babies it down. Kinda silly if you ask me. Edit: As someone who knows the timers, but fails at doing math quickly in their head, actually using these things to my advantage comes hard and I'm proud if myself when I can do it under pressure. When other noobs of my skill range don't even have to think about it, it makes me a little upset. :[[/quote]

[quote=Nighthawk]it doesn't give you an advantage over the enemy in terms of drag/baron timers the enemy has the option to scroll up to their chat and look at the timer just like you do, it's not hard[/quote]

[quote=DillButt64]im pretty sure people said the same "omg people should just lrn2math" thing when riot was putting the map indicators for jungle camps on the minimap plus we already sort of get timers on teammate cooldowns in the form of the green dot so why not just have a countdown next to it? if anything thall promote more skillful play "oh renektons ult is going to be up in 30 seconds i should be ready to head up there for a gank" rather than "the dot is not green top is not going to be a good place to gank for a while" same thing with dragon timers but a little bit less since its really just adding 6 or 7 but its nice to have that notice on your HUD especially if there is a huge conversation in chat and your timer you typed is now miles away in chat and you happen to not remember it but at least if everyone gets it then everyone would be ready to compete for the objective rather than the one guy on the team keeping the timer saying "dragon up in 1 min be ready" "45 seconds drag" "30 seconds drag pls jax dont be top" (but srs talk we all know in low elos thatll happen even with the timer right in peoples faces)[/quote]