Best Counter Junglers?

[quote=JPBucketz]So, I'm playing at low ELO, and have been playing around with different roles. One area I really think can be taken advantage of in low ELO games is counter-jungling, warding the enemy jungle, and stealing buffs. SO many junglers at low elo don't really worry about timers and just get so set in their usual path that they don't have great map awareness. So I was curious who you think are the best junglers to take advantage of this, to steal buffs, to win 1v1 fights in their jungle (also able to take advantage of this because team's reactions are so slow), etc. I know some people recommend shaco - I suck at him. So other recs are appreciated! THANKS![/quote]

[quote=DuffTime]DON'T pick your jungle with intent of counterjungling. You're fucking your whole team over if you do that.[/quote]

[quote=Xenasis]Ignore Duff and go and watch some of Moscow Five's gameplay. Diamondprox practically counterjungles permanently, and many of their victories stem from his playstyle. Shutting down a jungler completely and giving lanes indirect advantages is sometimes better than giving a lane a direct advantage. I'd say - Shaco (though you mentioned him), Maokai, Lee Sin, Shyvana, and Udyr.[/quote]

[quote=Pølsemanden]Pretty much the ones Xenasis mentioned. Although i don't see maokai as a great counter-jungler. If he get's caught, he be fucked! I myself prefer shaco, since that makes it for u just to be anywhere at all times. Either in the lanes ganking or in the enemy jungle to steal creeps, then goes to his own jungle if he needs the 50 gold from one of the camps for an item.[/quote]

[quote=Xenasis][quote=Pølsemanden] Although i don't see maokai as a great counter-jungler. If he get's caught, he be fucked! [/quote] Saplings are incredible tools for tracking the jungler down without having to actually go in there yourself like, say, Shvyana has to. He also has a big burst and a lot of CC - when your mid comes to help they can't so easily run.[/quote]

[quote=Pølsemanden]If u're talking counter-jungling as in killing the enemy champion, u shouldn't use saplings. That's what wards are for, saplings alert the enemy jungler. If u're talking camp steals he needs the saplings for a good clear-time. Shaco on the other hand is blue-unreliant, meaning his mid can push till the end of time. Therefore easier assisting him in killing an enemy jungler, he also has more mobility, better 1v1'ing and does not get punished nearly as easy. I reaaally don't think maokai brings much to the table as a counter-jungler, buut i quess my narrow-minded self is just not capable of seeing the endless possibilities he has :p[/quote]

[quote=FlamingWalrus]Counter jungling? Well, the best one in terms of killing them are probably Shaco (terrorist much?), Lee Sin and Trundle (against tankier junglers). Other viables include Maokai, Nocturne, Skarner or any high damage junglers. In terms of killing creeps it's definately Nunu (consume=free smite), Udyr, Shyvana, Cho'Gath (6+) or Evelyn (not recommended at all, but the stealth is a get out of jail free card). Basically anybody can counter jungle, but it's really not your primary goal in the jungle. You should really be intending on getting your lanes fed and farming yourself up, although if the opportunity comes, then by all means go do it.[/quote]

[quote=abzilla]i htink for counter JUNGLING you'll need a fast clearing champ. [[lee sin]] [[shyvana]] come to mind. I haven't tried [[shaco]] so I can't tell you how fats he clears jungles. I think thats what op is asking for. [[lee sin]] and [[syvana]] can clear fast and thats a good way to play. If the enemy is on to you, well then you still have a damn decent jungler :D[/quote]

[quote=MyRepublic]I'd say [[nocturne]] in my experience. I've jungled with and against him and he's a real threat if played aggressively. However other good choices would be assassins. Just run in, get a kill, steal buff, get back to jungling. They'd be the easiest to do the COUNTER part of it with at least. The normal jungling would be more of a challenge.[/quote]