Crit CHANCE?or Crit DAMAGE?RUNES

[quote=GrandmasterD][quote=Luther3000] Shit just got real. [/quote] Very true :P[/quote]

[quote=Darcurse]ArP better early and AD better late... dont see the problems you lot seem to have...? And if your 3rd-4th item is going to be LW anyway: Fuck early, AD all the way.[/quote]

[quote=Searz]^It's the other way around. AD for early and ArP for mid/late. (mistype or just fail at reading the thread?) But in marks you get more damage with ArP against champions even early on. I'm "working" with NikkiD to get the exact numbers through a 3D graph. He'll post it here soon I believe.[/quote]

[quote=Darcurse]Do that, but the moment you got the same amount ArP as the enemy got armor you're at the peak(excludign armor reduction), every additional armor is going to shrink the %-dmg reduction you cleared. (Not going to use exact numbers, easier that way) 30 ArP, 30 armor: enemy lost the whole ~20% physical dmg reduction he had. 30 ArP, 100 armor: enemy lost around ~12-14% of his physical dmg reduction. Early > late.[/quote]

[quote=Searz]But you totally forget the fundamentals of how AD works. AD is a flat bonus (additive) that only can be increased in effectiveness by crit. ArP on the other hand increases ALL your physical damage and gains effectiveness from everything that increases your physical damage, that includes AD, and AD increases per level, while CrC doesn't. It only takes a few levels for ArP to completely "screw over" AD, regardless of how much armor your enemies have.[/quote]

[quote=Darcurse]You're right if we talk about AD casters with mediocre-bad ratios and high base dmg. ArP lowers the resistance of enemies against any physical dmg you deal, but AD simply increases ANY physical dmg you deal and thus is affected by anything else (ArP,ArR,AS,CrC,indirectly CrD). Flat ArP is great early since it prevents you from loosing a high percent of your dmg output. But since that amount weakens with every armorpoint the enemy has more than you ArP, it's not going to work your way later in game. Let's say your average joe champ starts with 15-20 armor, gains 3.5 armor a level and has flat armor seals. That means he starts with ~30 armor and has around ~47 at level 6 and ~90 at level 18. With marks/quints ArP and Sunderer you get ~30 ArP (excluding 10% mastery) so you will effectively counter every enemy at level 1. But since armor increases with every level while ArP doesn't the enemy steadily increases his physical dmg reduction. You have to buy Brutalizer to keep up but your runes will still loose the moment he exceeds 45. And by then somebody else picked AD runes instead and bought LW. This will be the moment where your ArP runes lost (double time) at the latest.[/quote]

[quote=Lugignaf]Just FYI, if you're a carry, getting the 10% armor penetration mastery will put you at about the same point(as armor pen marks) late game if you're fighting another AD carry. You'll be a little worse off early game as you're only penning like, 1 or 2 armor(base armor for AD carries is usually 10-20) but it's not going to make much a difference as you're going to have that late game from extra CS because you took AD.[/quote]

[quote=Searz][quote=Darcurse] You're right if we talk about AD casters with mediocre-bad ratios and high base dmg.[/quote] No, I'm right regarding AD carries too. Take a look in my graphing thread in theory crafting for proof. Those graphs don't include masteries, but the difference is so big that it hardly is affected by the 10% loss. Miss Nikki Danger can confirm it if you're unsure.[/quote]

[quote=Turbo Punz]Heh, funny story. Me and a friend were playing duo-q and we get into a game. For some odd reason, their shaco wasn't jungle... He kept on fucking raping us pre-6 cuz OF FUCKING CRIT RUNES. FUCKING ONE SHOT LOL[/quote]

[quote=Searz]Funny thing is; he woulda raped you even harder with AD runes.[/quote]