I only buy 2 defensive items on mord but I suppose he could be build more tanky. I dont like thornmail on him but I do agree that armor is needed in some form or another. I usually get Guardian Angel because i find that on mord it is awesome for both mr+armor to go along with warmog. I accept your ideas and +1 for the effort behind them

That's not true, my friend. You are confused.

A quick little note about "Overpushing".

I just finished a pick up game. I had Caitlyn as my partner, and was facing Ezreal and Soraka.

I harassed early, and while I got ganked twice, I was also able to return 2 kills for those ganks immediately after.

Cait said something interesting to me: "Why are you pushing so hard?"
I replied "I'm Mord. I push."
She said "If you keep pushing, we're never going to kill them."
I replied: "Don't need to kill them."

Top lane was getting hit heavy, and their mid Sion was getting fed. Never-the-less, I kept on pushing. The enemy turret in my lane went down reasonably fast.

I moved to mid. Thanks to a team fight in top lane that my team was able to sustain, I pushed over the mid tower within 3 minutes of moving out of the base to mid lane.

I moved to top, and with the help of 2 team mates pushed over the top tower very quickly as well.

This all happened in the space of 8 minutes.

Keep in mind that the enemy team continued to wrack up kills. We were behind 13/19 at one point.

In the end, it didn't matter. I kept pushing, attacking lanes where my opponents were not. My goal wasn't to backdoor, it was to pressure the lanes.

And it worked. Again and again and again.

While the enemy team was busy trying to clean the lanes and save their towers, we were free to hit dragon, push other lanes and gank stray enemy champs as a team. Yes, we lost team fights, but we won some as well.

In the end, we ended up winning the game in ~35 minutes, with a final score of 22/24... yes, they had 2 more kills than we did.

We lost 1 tower.

This isn't the exception - it's the rule.
The game is about winning.
Turrets are in the way of your win.
Knock over the turrets.
Win.

spell vamp doesnt work with thorn becuase its a passive
it only works with skills and actives on items

Sadly, Mobafire doesn't allow for the item build to display optional items - I cover this in my item building section. Warmog's and Shurelya's are situational, and are meant to demonstrate the flexibility of the build's 6th item. Again, there's flexibility here.

In my item section, I mention upgrading the revolver into the gunblade - you could just as easily upgrade it to a WOA instead. You have to make the call in the game. I trust you to know your game, team and playstyle better than I do, and to make calls on the fly.


I respect that opinion. I use Frozen Heart on my tanks a lot if the situation calls for it. That said, there is no synergy between Frozen Heart and a spellvamp item. Thornmail does have this.

The CDR is, for me, a matter of play style. I rarely need more CDR because I'm judicious with my ability usage. I don't try to burst opponents - this is something I note a lot of players, regardless of champ, do. That hasn't worked for me because Mord's damage output, while very strong in the aggregate, isn't as high on single targets as a pure AP caster or AD Carry.



I mentioned this in my post. Shurelya's is there as a matter of choice - it gives CDR, but also gives an escape for those players who want the mobility of teleport AND the damage bonus of ignite.



Again, I mention this in the text of the guide, friend. I don't see Mord as an AP carry at all. Mord is meant to push in my opinion. The damage he does is fine, but he isn't going to keep up with a champ designed to dish out damage. He shouldn't try is my point. He's value to the group at the middle/end of the game is in slowing multiple targets for team kills, turning 5v5 fights into 6v4 fights, and pushing down the last turrets.



I disagree. I think you're still seeing the game in terms of kills = wins. This is a false presumption. A mobile Mord can threaten other lanes, can help junglers, and can harass very well. This doesn't mean he ignores his original laning assignment, or the tower he's designated to protect.



The 10% disable reduction is a great choice, but as a matter of preference I like the added AP for the early game. If I really need tenacity, I can take boots. This moves Mord towards tanking, and I don't see him that way, but I'm pragmatic. If the situation calls for more defense, I'll build that way.



I hear what you're saying, and you raise some interesting points. To rebut:

As a general rule, if you're playing smart and not feeding your team should be advancing in experience about as quickly as the opposing team does. Talents and Runes aside, you should be able to keep pace. Remember that when the opposing team attempts to freeze the lane, they have to commit time and champs to it.

In chess, we call the action of holding enemy resources in place "pinning". It works in that game and this one.

If I'm pushing so hard that I'm forcing the enemy team to commit 3 players to my lane, I'm doing my team a favor by pinning them to that lane. If my lane partner and I can stay alive and sustain in the lane with those 3 committed, my team mates now have greater mobility and forward momentum. In chess, this is called gaining "initiative" or "tempo".

This works wonders. The opposing team is so often surprised to see that while they may be ahead by 3 to even 5 kills in a worst case scenario, they're actually losing the game. They can't act because they're constantly reacting to my teams play.

That's always a good thing.



Much appreciated. I encourage you to try the build with some friends, and see how you do. Let me know if you have more thoughts at that point. For my part, my team mates have tried this build even in Pickup Games, and have noticed two things:

1) Mord becomes more team dependent. I personally don't think Mord "becomes" more team dependent - I think all team mates depend on each other all the time. That said, Mord has to be played with this build like a member of a team, and not try to win the game by himself.

2) The game takes on a new dynamic that most opposing teams are unprepared for. When you're playing fluidly with your team and pushing the lanes as well as you can, the game changes from "kill lots and build cool items" to "Win". It becomes more like chess, and less like Super Mario Brothers.



I respect that, and thanks for your constructive input.

GG

I do take FoN, but Warmogs is situational.

Thornmail DOES proc spellvamp - check many wikis ;)

The final build DOES have boots, I think you're reading it wrong.

I have no idea what tp is ;)

Thanks for reading the guide and critiquing!

You have many things that one may disagree with.

Items:

- I count 7 items (boots, revolver, thornmail, force of nature, rylai's, warmog's, shurelya's)
- Thornmail should never be a core item to anyone, contrary to common belief. It's VERY situational (enemy team with glass cannon AD's really raping everyone, and at least 2-3 of them). Frozen Heart will be better all the time and, even though it has a mana item, it's still better since it gives CDR.
- Why Shurelya? To have something coming from heart of gold? The active doesn't make you an amazing initiator anyway..
- Nearly no ap items. You'll be a full tank lategame, so if your team has no other damage sources besides an AD carry, the carry dying in battle = pretty much complete loss.


Masteries:

- Demolitionist is terrible. Most of the time you don't want to end the turret on your lane too early because you need to farm and, if you do and go roam, you're giving the ap caster - the character that is both GOLD and EXPERIENCE dependant both for free.
- The extra point on Ability Power would be better used to help you get a full ap tank mastery tree on the defensive side;
- 1 point in vigor is useless;
- Siege Commander goes with Demolitionist, I'm guessing. You really want to take down them turrets early, but if things don't snowball to your team's favour you can hardly backdoor by yourself, making both points useless.

I understand you see him as a pusher. However, pushing doesn't equal hitting down turrets, nor does it benefit your early. If you force teamfight fase before your team is ready, soon it's your own turrets that'll be taken down. And Dragon. And Baron. Map dominance requires more than turrets taken down.

I understand you say your friends run this at well. It may work. with that synergy, or may not. Personally, I think it may depend on your opponent's level. High leveled opponents will freeze the lane or exploit the fact that you're overpushing so soon.

Don't get me wrong, it's an interesting take. I just don't think it's enough to carry.



As for the guide itself, it is well written and has a lot of well placed emphasis on the points you desire to get accross. I personally believe you should try getting a bit more images and breaks there though. Jhoijhoi has a Karthus thread with all its ups and downs.

In conclusion: I will not downvote this at all, because it'd be bs. It's your approach. However, I don't agree enough with it that I would give my "approval".

you said he isn't a tank but you buy Fon thorn and warmog. your guide has several mistakes.

Thornmail doesn't work with spell vamp you can check the wiki, you max e until level 12, your finished build doesn't have boots but instead you have shurelya... ap seals and tp in summoners 11 19 masteries

woa on morde really

Why no WOA?

Why no WOA?

Thanks for the feedback - I'm taking it to heart and adjusting. I hadn't realized I had inadvertently made the case that Mord is best as a solo lane champ; I'm addressing that now ;)

Cheers!