COUNTER PICKING

[quote=DuffTime][quote=Khazem] True. Assuming she's not behind on levels and not too far behind on farm. Sure it's true damage and all, but you need to take into account creep damage/the fact that the other AD will be ahead and stronger overall. [/quote] *Shakey hand* You won't be thaaaaat far behind if you play smart. [quote=Khazem] The way bottom lane is usually played against Vayne is you push her to her tower. She deals poorly with being pushed early game. Alot of champions have free reign over the lane against Vayne pre-6, which is where they can get ahead far enough to not die to her when she does hit 6, UNLESS she gets a lot of jungle support and that's exactly why I think she's a weak laner. Especially currently, a lot of how a lane goes is decided pre-6. [/quote] Yes, pre 6 a lot of champions have free reign. But she doesn't care that much if you push her though. I can last hit just fine, I'll probably miss 1-3 creeps per wave, but my opponent might miss 1-2. As long as I keep up in levels, I'm fine. If my opponent has an extra Doran's blade, it doesn't matter. I will still just kill them around level 9 for free. If I get jungle support it's a plus but I wouldn't say I'm just useless and fucked, sobbing as I wait for my jungle. I don't think that's the case at all. Before long, I can just win the lane with or without jungle support.[/quote]

[quote=Temzilla][quote=EvilDice] [quote=Temzilla] Trundle counters Yorick. [/quote] All melee counters spammable ranged poke? Wat. [/quote] Yorick Casts E. Yorick deals ~50 damage to Trundle, Trundle heals because of the ghoul dying. Yorick crys, because he has to choose between last hitting with ghouls, running oom really fast, and giving trundle free health, or last hitting in melee range, and losing trades to trundle. Trundle has enough base lifesteal from just killing creeps that Yorick has to duel him to win any kind of trades, and Trundle has so much damage in his kit, that he just has to right click Yorick to beat him in a duel. It's a farm lane, but trundle can't be ganked and yorick can. [quote=Nighthawk] I kind of facepalmed at your post Tem...so wrong... Soraka counters Karthus. Also Zilean in lane. Uhm, Nasus is a soft counter to Singed in lane. Renekton counters Nasus hard in lane. Nasus counters WW and Alistar in lane. Gragas and Janna counter AoE teams. Tsric is a check to MF. dat's all I got off the top of my head. [/quote] Soraka doesn't counter Zilean in lane. Zilean has more range, and cs perfectly, and zilean can easily run away from soraka. I was speaking of AP SOLO SORAKA. Not support soraka. Nasus vs Soraka means 90% of the time soraka's team WINS THE GAME, BECAUSE IT IS A 4v5 AND NASUS IS COMPLETELY USELESS. Gragas doesn't counter AoE teams, positioning counters AoE teams.[/quote]

[quote=Thalia Kael]shyvana counters all[/quote]

[quote=MajorLoL]Teemo counters all autoattackers,like [[Vayne]],[[Ashe]],[[Caitlyn]],[[Graves]],etc.[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime]He sure doesn't counter Vayne and I don't think he counters Graves either.[/quote]

[quote=Temzilla][quote=DuffTime] He sure doesn't counter Vayne and I don't think he counters Graves either. [/quote] He doesn't counter any AD's. The reason is his range. If his blinding Dart had 700 range, and lasted long enough that you could get into range, auto attack once, and then get out of their range at the same time, then it probably would make him a counter. Blinding dart doesn't have enough range, and toxic shot doesn't do enough damage for him to win trades vs Caitlyn or Vayne. If it lasted long enough that graves always lost his mr/armor stacks when teemo Q'd him, teemo would be pretty effective against him. Would still lose trades to buckshot if not runed properly. And, like i said earlier... Everyone counters ashe.[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime]Mmm. Understood :)[/quote]