Melee Carries...

[quote=Xenasis]Just made a thread on the EU forums (lol EU forums) so I doubt any red will see it (other than Ymir, who's the wrong department) but I'd like your thoughts on this. http://eu.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=305910 Copied/pasted - I was just wondering. Are Melee Carries going to be getting buffs any time soon? I think the only two that are kind of viable are Xin ((if you'd consider him a carry) who got nerfed last patch) and Nocturne, who is barely, barely viable. Nunu (who's a perfect counterpick to Noc) can decimate a Noc in the jungle. Denying Noc of levels and gold is worse than any other jungler. On the Dreamhack picks (https://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Avxl80wWQb1UdGI3TEhXVFdmcmVxUGF5X29NQmp6Mnc#gid=0), the first melee carry, Nocturne, is the 24th most picked. He's the only one that was picked more than once (assuming you don't count Lee Sin as a carry, he's more of an off tank, really), and GP is the only other one on there, with 1 pick. Comparing that with the amount of ranged AD carries is astounding... I don't claim to know every in and out of champions, but clearly the pros at Dreamhack did. Let's be honest, if you picked Tryndamere or Yi in a top tier/high elo game you'd be considered a troll, but if you picked one of the "bad" ranged AD carries (Ez/Cait) you'd be considered a good pick, but still less than optimal. I understand that GP is in a great place now, and GP is actually a really good melee carry. However, having only ONE good melee carry surely isn't right, is it? EDIT: I DIDN'T MEAN AD bruisers like Jarvan, etc. I meant AD carries. The melee equivalents of Corki/Ashe/Vayne/MF/Cait/Ez/etc.[/quote]

[quote=Lugignaf]The only melee carry I can think of is Nocturne and, to a lesser extent, Nasus. Irelia's an off-tank and Akali is just god-mode really fast. Yi BDs all day and Tryn is just... Tryn.[/quote]

[quote=Xenasis]Since when was Akali AD? :/[/quote]

[quote=ZeroRacer]It's a fundemental question about positioning during the fights. A ranged carry is allowed to poke while the fight is about to start, or is about to commence, but a melee carry can't even go in until most of the action has died off. They are reduced to being cleanup crew while ranged carries, even if they can't fully commit til later during the fight, can keep a constant stream of dps going. I play yi quite a bit along with shaco(whose a high dmg dps assasin, who has a reputation for blowing up often), and what I am reduced to before and during a teamfight starts is simply spectating. The issue is that going in any earlier means time and time again...dropping dead. I'm not allowed to go balls deep without counting stuns and aoe.[/quote]

[quote=Xenasis][quote=ZeroRacer] It's a fundemental question about positioning during the fights. A ranged carry is allowed to poke while the fight is about to start, or is about to commence, but a melee carry can't even go in until most of the action has died off. They are reduced to being cleanup crew while ranged carries, even if they can't fully commit til later during the fight, can keep a constant stream of dps going. I play yi quite a bit along with shaco(whose a high dmg dps assasin, who has a reputation for blowing up often), and what I am reduced to before and during a teamfight starts is simply spectating. The issue is that going in any earlier means time and time again...dropping dead. I'm not allowed to go balls deep without counting stuns and aoe. [/quote] Yeah. I'll quote something I said in response in that thread, as it fits PERFECTLY as an answer to that too. "I think Nocturne was being took in the right direction. Decent bulk without items, Spellshield, easy way to CC at a distance, and cause people to stop focussing you, by escaping the CC or getting CC'd, and a way to literally dive at their enemy carries. If they're bad, and "can't be buffed", as you put it, then why are they in the game?..."[/quote]

[quote=ZeroRacer]I think I remember an earlier time when olaf was 100% viable in his older incarnation(he has issues right now, most of which involve speeds), the beautiful words CC immunity along with mammoth lifesteal made him great back then. One of my premade buddies always was quite the man with the plan...ghost/ult and go straight for that juicy ashe. It's Riot's least subtle way to tackle the issue(Hey Morello,...how about just this once...we give a melee carry a BKB?), but it definitely worked. Still awaiting those changes to keep him continually relevant.[/quote]

[quote=Lugignaf]I spaced. I thought you said "melee carries".[/quote]

[quote=Atarios][quote=Xenasis] Since when was Akali AD? :/ [/quote] Not fully AD. More of a Hybrid,[/quote]

[quote=Xenasis][quote=Atarios] Not fully AD. More of a Hybrid, [/quote] She's much better built pure AP pretty much... like Ezreal is better built AD.[/quote]

[quote=theBMB][quote=Atarios] [quote=Xenasis] Since when was Akali AD? :/ [/quote] Not fully AD. More of a Hybrid, [/quote] AD akali is just plain not good, and if you build her hybrid, you need to lean more towards AP. I don't think she fits into this discussion. It's interesting, because when melee champs can act as carries (i.e olaf and nocturne before nerfs) they usually are TOO good. As in, "run away in fear whenever they come close" good. I'm not completely sure why that is, but that tends to be the case.[/quote]