strength of spirit(mastery) change

[quote=NicknameMy]Actually, at earlygame to midgame you will have very high mana problems, because [[ryze]] depends onto that harass at that stage. For this, I thought this combo would be great.[/quote]

[quote=Luther3000][quote=NicknameMy] Actually, at earlygame to midgame you will have very high mana problems, because [[ryze]] depends onto that harass at that stage. For this, I thought this combo would be great. [/quote] What? Mana problems on Ryze? Since when? Perseverance gives 9% extra regen assuming you put all three points into it. This might sound like a lot, but let's assume you somehow get 100 health regen in a match. This is more or less an impossibly high amount and would never happen. You would still only be getting an extra 9 regen from Perseverance, which is a pretty pointless amount. The mana regen you get from it is even worse. It's not the worst mastery ever, but no one in their right mind would choose it over [[Intelligence]]. On Ryze in particular [[Strength of Spirit]] was absolutely amazing, giving him around 30-40 health regen per 5 later in the game. I miss it. :c[/quote]

[quote=Xenasis][quote=Luther3000] What? Mana problems on Ryze? Since when? Perseverance gives 9% extra regen assuming you put all three points into it. This might sound like a lot, but let's assume you somehow get 100 health regen in a match. This is more or less impossibly high and would never happen. You would still only be getting an extra 9 regen from Perseverance, which is pretty pointless. The mana regen portion is even worse. It's not the worst mastery ever, but no one in their right mind would choose it over [[Intelligence]]. [/quote] QFT Ryze VERY rarely has mana problems, if he gets blue he has unlimited harass, and he's one of the few magic damage champions that builds some sort of mana regen in his Tear. @Nickname You mentioned it was only early to mid game, which is when Perseverance is the worst. Percentage based bonuses of already small numbers when against CDR is just silly. Don't know why Riot included that mastery tbh.[/quote]

[quote=abzilla]These are the masteries I'm using for my [[ryze]] build [masteries=http://www.mobafire.com/league-of-legends/mastery-tree-planner#&tree1=0-2-0-2-0-4-0-0-0-1-0-0-0-0-0-0-0&tree2=0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0&tree3=1-3-3-1-4-0-0-0-0-1-0-4-0-0-3-1&v=2] I never have mana problems or health problems in game. Look for my guide for detailed explanations on [[ryze]] if ya want, my style could be similar to yours :)[/quote]

[quote=JunSupport]Just man up and learn to not rely on health regen and just be all-around better at laning. I never used [[Strength of Spirit]] - I felt the [[Presence of the Master]] is a better mastery to have. Always did just fine.[/quote]

[quote=Xenasis][quote=JunSupport] I never used [[Strength of Spirit]] - I felt the [[Presence of the Master]] is a better mastery to have. Always did just fine. [/quote] Why would you ever take a point from Presence of the Master for Strength of Spirit? You go 0/9/21 and have the best of both worlds. It's not "relying" on the regeneration. Regeneration is a stat just like AP is. Talon was really strong mainly because of his crazy regeneration. He got nerfed, and lo and behold, he wasn't nearly as good. When you're talking about 6 HP5 for 3 points at level 1 on Ryze, scaling into considerably more (40+ late game), that's an opportunity you simply couldn't miss. There's a difference between taking free regeneration like Ryze does, or starting with ridiculous regeneration a Meki Pendant (or Doran's Ring) on ANY caster because you can't manage your mana even though it doesn't build into anything. You don't need to alter your build in the slightest if you take Strength of Spirit, and it was so, so, ridiculously strong on him. He had one of the best laning presences in the game because of it.[/quote]

[quote=Luther3000]If you did that, you missed out on the cooldowns and the 15% spellpen from offence though. I always went something like 9/9/12 I think (can't check anymore since the page no longer exists). Of course it's kinda pointless to argue about it since it's no longer possible to get [[Strength of Spirit]] anyway. 9/0/21 is what I'd use now.[/quote]

[quote=JunSupport]@Xenasis: As Luther3000 said, I used [[Archaic knowledge]]. Choosing your masteries was always choice between [[Presence of the Master]] and [[Strength of Spirit]] You should never go 0/9/21 - That's just dumb. [[Strength of Spirit]] was ALWAYS a non-essential mastery point on Ryze. Also, if you do take [[Strength of Spirit]] over 15% magic pen or 15% summoner spell reduction - You ARE relying on it. It's not free. And it seems you're just full of misread criticisms, huh? Strength of Spirit is a health-regenerating mastery point. It has nothing to do with Meki Pendant - A good starting item for Ryze because it builds into Tear. Doran's Ring stacking is also a good strategy, I shouldn't even need to explain this. Every mastery below tier 1 has a cost. It's the opportunity cost of choosing one mastery over another. Like whether or not you choose to answer a booty call or finish that important work assignment you haven't started that's due tomorrow. Whatever decision you make costs you the benefits of the other decision.[/quote]

[quote=Vort]Relative to the gains everyone else received from the mastery changes, Ryze recieved a hefty nerf. 'nuf said.[/quote]

[quote=caucheka]not really. the only thing that affects ryze is the removal of strength of spirit. hell i can get 5.5k mana on ryze easily, he shouldnt need that regen if he can deal that much damage, especially with the magic pen mastery.[/quote]