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Idk, I've never considered a Q max Irelia before, I don't know if it's good or not.
And Zephyr is insane on Irelia. :P
without merc treads, against an ad comp, I can certainly see it.
I just don't like it. :P
Irelia has to win the pre 9 levels hard for her to be able to beat Nasus, but she can do it. Levels 1-4 it's really really really easy to beat him down hard by just repeatedly Q'ing to a minion, E'ing him, and backing off. Even just Q > W stand there autoing him > E out wins you lane. If you can win lane hard enough you can zone him out of those first 50 or so minions, and that's a pretty big deal which can snowball the lane really hard. If Nasus plays agressive you can just use Q to CS and not miss any, which Nasus cannot do if he's harassing you. You also shouldn't underestimate her Q damage, I'd probably max Q against Nasus and go Triforce since like you say Wither negates all of your W damage. A Q > AA > E > AA combo still works though.
just saying, she can beat him.
Idk, I've never considered a Q max Irelia before, I don't know if it's good or not.
And Zephyr is insane on Irelia. :P
Irelia has next to no poke though, ESPECIALLY against someone with as much sustain as Nasus. All she has is engagement. Her fighting is **** early-game without Hiten Style turned on, and the only stat Hiten Style scales on is attack speed, which Wither is a complete counter to. If you try to "poke" him, he sustains it all back without breaking a sweat. If you try and fight him without turning on your W, he wins. If you try and fight him with your W on, he uses his W on you, and you both can't win, nor escape.
And even if you just afk farm and stay even in farm with him, he's still winning his lane because he gains more from each last-hit than you do. All you gain is gold, he gains gold and damage. By the end of the afk farming phase, you could come out with 3000 extra gold, and he could come out with 3000 extra gold and 400 extra Q damage. He wins.
He even temporarily nullifies you in team-fights, as you won't be doing **** with 5% attack speed.
Irelia has to win the pre 9 levels hard for her to be able to beat Nasus, but she can do it. Levels 1-4 it's really really really easy to beat him down hard by just repeatedly Q'ing to a minion, E'ing him, and backing off. Even just Q > W stand there autoing him > E out wins you lane. If you can win lane hard enough you can zone him out of those first 50 or so minions, and that's a pretty big deal which can snowball the lane really hard. If Nasus plays agressive you can just use Q to CS and not miss any, which Nasus cannot do if he's harassing you. You also shouldn't underestimate her Q damage, I'd probably max Q against Nasus and go Triforce since like you say Wither negates all of your W damage. A Q > AA > E > AA combo still works though.
just saying, she can beat him.
Vapora Dark, I agree that Nasus's Wither applies alot of attack speed defbuff. However, it's cooldown is 15,14,13,12,11 seconds. If he maxes it second he will have it at 11 seconds at level 13. At this point of time, all you have to do is wait for wither to finish and you harass back. Wither applies for 5 seconds, so at level 13, Irelia has 6 seconds of free poke allowing you to utilize Hiten Style fully. If nasus tries to farm, you merely poke at him until he pops Wither wait for it to finish and poke again.
Irelia has next to no poke though, ESPECIALLY against someone with as much sustain as Nasus. All she has is engagement. Her fighting is **** early-game without Hiten Style turned on, and the only stat Hiten Style scales on is attack speed, which Wither is a complete counter to. If you try to "poke" him, he sustains it all back without breaking a sweat. If you try and fight him without turning on your W, he wins. If you try and fight him with your W on, he uses his W on you, and you both can't win, nor escape.
And even if you just afk farm and stay even in farm with him, he's still winning his lane because he gains more from each last-hit than you do. All you gain is gold, he gains gold and damage. By the end of the afk farming phase, you could come out with 3000 extra gold, and he could come out with 3000 extra gold and 400 extra Q damage. He wins.
He even temporarily nullifies you in team-fights, as you won't be doing **** with 5% attack speed.
I think the problem is more that Irelia needs that true damage, and that when she activates it, and nasus uses Wither, they end at nearly the same time and then Irelia's damage has a huge falloff. So, Irelia can only trade really well when Nasus engages the trade, which is something that will barely happen.Also, you forgot the 40% CDR most nasus players will have at some point
I do think that Irelia is pretty good against Nasus, just because she can beat Nasus all game long (since Irelia barely falls of into lategame) and nasus only wins in like 50+ minute games.
True Vynertje, I can see your point of view. Thus, this lane becomes more of a free-farm lane until Irelia gets damage from bork/wit's end or other attack speed item. Most Nasus players activate Wither right when I use Hiten Style but that is usually after I get 2 hits out. The major factors in this lane would be, who has more mana, and which jungler ganks more. If Nasus has mana, while Irelia is ooom, then Nasus can easily take down Irelia. The same applies vice versa. However, from my perspective, Irelia can wait until Nasus applies Wither, take a couple of hits here and there, and THEN deal damage to him. However, even if Nasus wait for Irelia to activate Hiten Style, Irelia deals alot of damage just with Bork and wit's end.
Ultimately, if Irelia does not win early game, she wins mid-game/late-game from her massive farm, but the enemy Nasus poses a threat to your carries since he will have farmed his Q to an extent.
Vapora Dark, I agree that Nasus's Wither applies alot of attack speed defbuff. However, it's cooldown is 15,14,13,12,11 seconds. If he maxes it second he will have it at 11 seconds at level 13. At this point of time, all you have to do is wait for wither to finish and you harass back. Wither applies for 5 seconds, so at level 13, Irelia has 6 seconds of free poke allowing you to utilize Hiten Style fully. If nasus tries to farm, you merely poke at him until he pops Wither wait for it to finish and poke again.
I think the problem is more that Irelia needs that true damage, and that when she activates it, and nasus uses Wither, they end at nearly the same time and then Irelia's damage has a huge falloff. So, Irelia can only trade really well when Nasus engages the trade, which is something that will barely happen.Also, you forgot the 40% CDR most nasus players will have at some point
I do think that Irelia is pretty good against Nasus, just because she can beat Nasus all game long (since Irelia barely falls of into lategame) and nasus only wins in like 50+ minute games.