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Ellodere
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Pros.
Much less chance of drake steal when both the jungler and support has smite.
You can perform things like hooks and smiting the minion that blocks the enemy adc (kind of like lee sin when he q's and smites a minion to hit it)
If you start double golems with your adc, you can smite it and you get a buff from it (golem buff) or you smite the frog and you receive the other buff which is pretty strong in lane (whenever someone hits you, they will be poisoned).
Can be used together with relic shield to get the proc off and heal/give gold to your adc if you can't risk going up to the minion and auto attacking it (I think it works like that).
You can perform dragon and baron steals by yourself and together with your own jungler.
Cons.
The other support has an exhaust/ignite/heal over you.
The enemy laners will probably fight you and your adc fairly easily.
If your team goes behind, smite will not be as good as it would be if you were ahead and had objective control.
That's the only things I could think of, maybe there might be more to it than what my brain can logically tell.
Much less chance of drake steal when both the jungler and support has smite.
You can perform things like hooks and smiting the minion that blocks the enemy adc (kind of like lee sin when he q's and smites a minion to hit it)
If you start double golems with your adc, you can smite it and you get a buff from it (golem buff) or you smite the frog and you receive the other buff which is pretty strong in lane (whenever someone hits you, they will be poisoned).
Can be used together with relic shield to get the proc off and heal/give gold to your adc if you can't risk going up to the minion and auto attacking it (I think it works like that).
You can perform dragon and baron steals by yourself and together with your own jungler.
Cons.
The other support has an exhaust/ignite/heal over you.
The enemy laners will probably fight you and your adc fairly easily.
If your team goes behind, smite will not be as good as it would be if you were ahead and had objective control.
That's the only things I could think of, maybe there might be more to it than what my brain can logically tell.
Ellodere
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<Member>
Zordagoth wrote:
Another pro : Cd is much much shorter than Ignite/Exhaust
Yes, that's one other thing aswell.
OH! The support also gets gold from the smite if he last hits the drake (the jungle could exchange some last hits with the support so that he could get gold aswell).
Cons:
Pros:
there's already a thread where this has been discussed, given that the jungle items have been nerfed in the meantime the cons people talk about there are even more pertinent than they were then.
- You can't trade for **** early because now there's really nothing even vaguely comparable to
Exhaust (or Ignite, I suppose) that you can get. Not to mention the part where you have to spend gold on items to make it even usable against champions, while the enemy support can spend that gold on other things. - Unless someone else takes Exhaust your team will not have it. This is pretty big against assassins as Exhaust is an effective way of gimping their damage.
- The jungler is highly unlikely to share drake smites with you, they need the gold way more than you do. The only way you'll get the extra gold from having smite is if you run off to take the scuttle crabs regularly.
Pros:
- Congratulations! You have Smite, taking objectives will be faster
assuming the enemy jungler doesn't just walk bot and kill you before taking dragons themselves since your early game trading power is significantly worse than their bot lane's. - You get some buffs that don't make up for the lack of Exhaust
there's already a thread where this has been discussed, given that the jungle items have been nerfed in the meantime the cons people talk about there are even more pertinent than they were then.
Ok lets start with throwing out the pro's/con's list. It's a stupid way to look at this. Instead consider communication. Do you have team you regularly play with? If so the aforementioned pro's/con's are unnecessary and pointless. Also they are obvious.
The major question one should be asking in relation to "is support smite viable" is "can I use this smite to counter jungle?"
Or - "can a constant use of Krug Stun replace Exhaust"
Smite when used on Jungle mobs gives the benefit on cast not on Mob death - What this means is that a support can use Krug smite for an infinite period of time in the early game without ever not having it depending on buff length. How you might ask? Easy - don't kill the mob. Smite then leave jungle - you won't lose lane time and your jungle won't lose gold/xp.
So there is your answer to a lack of Exhaust, now Krug stun certainly is weaker BUT is it viable on certain Supports? Like say Nami and even skarner come to mind or maybe Leona(I don't play Leona so thats tentative).
Again any idiot can point out the obvious flaws, however this is theory-crafting so lets think outside the box. If you choose to play in this manner it opens up a whole new view of counter jungle strats possibly even morphing into a support solo counter Jungle if you can get an early lead.
Now would this work in a pick up game? No - Would it work without careful consideration of team comp and enemy team comp - NO. But could it work? Especially at lower ELO's non-meta strat's have a certain advantage: people are weak against what they don't expect. This advantage however would only occur if the team attempting support smite was 100% committed to this action and played in a style around it.
My short answer is I"d like to try this out but only with my a pre-made group. The more sure any enemy team is that non-meta is not viable the stronger this strat becomes. As with all non-generic play styles. The biggest advantage this strat has and a "pro" not mentioned above is "everyone assuming you took smite by accident".
The major question one should be asking in relation to "is support smite viable" is "can I use this smite to counter jungle?"
Or - "can a constant use of Krug Stun replace Exhaust"
Smite when used on Jungle mobs gives the benefit on cast not on Mob death - What this means is that a support can use Krug smite for an infinite period of time in the early game without ever not having it depending on buff length. How you might ask? Easy - don't kill the mob. Smite then leave jungle - you won't lose lane time and your jungle won't lose gold/xp.
So there is your answer to a lack of Exhaust, now Krug stun certainly is weaker BUT is it viable on certain Supports? Like say Nami and even skarner come to mind or maybe Leona(I don't play Leona so thats tentative).
Again any idiot can point out the obvious flaws, however this is theory-crafting so lets think outside the box. If you choose to play in this manner it opens up a whole new view of counter jungle strats possibly even morphing into a support solo counter Jungle if you can get an early lead.
Now would this work in a pick up game? No - Would it work without careful consideration of team comp and enemy team comp - NO. But could it work? Especially at lower ELO's non-meta strat's have a certain advantage: people are weak against what they don't expect. This advantage however would only occur if the team attempting support smite was 100% committed to this action and played in a style around it.
My short answer is I"d like to try this out but only with my a pre-made group. The more sure any enemy team is that non-meta is not viable the stronger this strat becomes. As with all non-generic play styles. The biggest advantage this strat has and a "pro" not mentioned above is "everyone assuming you took smite by accident".
Quoted:
Smite when used on Jungle mobs gives the benefit on cast not on Mob death - What this means is that a support can use Krug smite for an infinite period of time in the early game without ever not having it depending on buff length. How you might ask? Easy - don't kill the mob. Smite then leave jungle - you won't lose lane time and your jungle won't lose gold/xp.
You can only smite a monster once and it looses it buffs until cleared and respawned. Also, Krug stun doesn't work against champions.
BTW: I enjoy using it on
Volibear support, he benefits greatly from Enchantment: Cinderhulk and the Stalker's Blade as well. Though, Exhaust is also really nice.
I once played Braum with Smite by accident. The game went well for my team, we were in the lead from early on, so I can't say how it works systemically.
In this one game however, it felt good. I found the Chilling Smite to be just as useful as Exhaust (using them primarily as slows in games when you're ahead) or Ignite (bonus damage).
This does not apply however if the enemy mid laner or jungler becomes fed or farmed, as the damage reduction provided by Exhaust is typically why it is taken (the slow is a bonus, but not the primary use of the spell).
Situationally almost anything can prove to be useful, but generally speaking I would not suggest replacing Ignite, Exhaust, or Heal for Smite.
In this one game however, it felt good. I found the Chilling Smite to be just as useful as Exhaust (using them primarily as slows in games when you're ahead) or Ignite (bonus damage).
This does not apply however if the enemy mid laner or jungler becomes fed or farmed, as the damage reduction provided by Exhaust is typically why it is taken (the slow is a bonus, but not the primary use of the spell).
Situationally almost anything can prove to be useful, but generally speaking I would not suggest replacing Ignite, Exhaust, or Heal for Smite.
"You don't reach the top without a good Sherpa."
It's not bad on support blitz IMO. I've done stuff like flash in smite steal red at the start of the game and then kill the jungler. If you can do this there's about a 50% chance that the dude either quits outright or really loses his marbles.. Or you can just grab the monster and smite.
Also it helps with blitz anemic jungling. I like rangers trail blazer. You can use your skills, and then drop two aoes (smite + ult) gaining back health and mana. Late game you can obliteratie camps really quickly even with no ap / dmg items. So you can build tanky with lots of health and cinderhulk synergies well with that giving you A TON of extra health.
With scaling health wards and quints. And typical blitz items (relic, righteous glory, cinderhulk, ruby sightstone, mobi boots..) that adds up to over 5k health and that's only 5 items. Throw in warmogs and defensive masteries and it should be around 6.5k
A couple drawbacks are if you're alone in the jungle your are not helping team. And you leave your adc and yourself vunerable to ganks if you wander off to check camps.
Also it helps with blitz anemic jungling. I like rangers trail blazer. You can use your skills, and then drop two aoes (smite + ult) gaining back health and mana. Late game you can obliteratie camps really quickly even with no ap / dmg items. So you can build tanky with lots of health and cinderhulk synergies well with that giving you A TON of extra health.
With scaling health wards and quints. And typical blitz items (relic, righteous glory, cinderhulk, ruby sightstone, mobi boots..) that adds up to over 5k health and that's only 5 items. Throw in warmogs and defensive masteries and it should be around 6.5k
A couple drawbacks are if you're alone in the jungle your are not helping team. And you leave your adc and yourself vunerable to ganks if you wander off to check camps.
Brother Jank
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I usually get smite on support because when I play sona I black out my screen for MAXIMUM immersion purposes (because sona is blind). So I end up picking random summoner spells but I still win laning phase despite my horrible adc. So I'd say pick any spell you want and as long as you're good at this game you should be fine.
If you're not in the glorious Mordekaiser religion then you don't belong on this planet. m'amen
Is it a hype or something to really consider?
When more and more support will take smite in the competitive scene can it get nerfed?