River (A dark support)

[quote=Siridean]honestly, i think this is a really cool champion. his q acts as both a poking/harrassing tool and a valuable laning heal. berserk is a cool unique form of CC. i think this is a very cool ability and can help shut down the enemy carry, without being op. Life stream seems a little strange to me, as you already have a heal, but i guess this ability was designed to make someone very hard to kill while in a teamfight, so i can see this being a useful skill. Ultimate is also very unique and cool, though i beleive the dragging effect you have on the enemy is slightly on the OP side. if before a team fight you manage to hook a squishy, u can pull him into your team, which i think is a an unfair advantage, cuz that will almost immediately get you a kill, and make the team fight a 5v4, Especially if 'River' has high movement speed. maybe make the tether significantly longer or shorter, either giving your opponent the chance lengthen his distance between you and your team, or shorter so River has to put himself in danger. or maybe a hybrid of those two ideas, where the casting range is shorter than the tether itself. i think the passive is also a good idea. Did you have it in mind that it would refresh when healed? or how did you think that would work. i know it refreshes on attack, but lets say ur laning with a kayle... can u constantly build that sheild? and what about health pots? i apologize for the book. ps. i plus repped you :P[/quote]

[quote=Canoas]His offensive ultimate is still useless. Just compare it to a blitzcrank's pull, which one do you prefer? I'd go with blitz any day. Life stream is useless during battles and OP during laning phase. Blood magic's offensive attack is useless too since no one will use it and will only make it possible to misclick and attack an enemy instead. It's heal is way less powerful than Soraka's W. Berserk is shorter than rammus' taunt and has a bigger cd. It also gets weaker as you level it. The fact that AP is useless on your champion and it has no mana nor damaging skills makes this champion even worse. I was hoping you would listen to my advice if I said this once more. Right now your champion is useless past laning phase and the only thing he can do during laning phase is healing another champion. On it's own there's absolutely nothing he can do except pray for your enemy to be disconnected.[/quote]

[quote=Read]@Siri: TY @Canoas: First of all you compare to other champs a little much. Blood magic is keeping its offensive abililty. As a "DARK" Support all of her moves need to have a good but also a darker purpose. If she has say 500 AP which is reasonable end game with her still being tanky. She will do 750 damage at a range of 750. Thats great for poking. Also has great heal range.If an enemy has 300 HP Soraka can beat on on them all day. She won't kill them. River has the ability to have situational usefulness on nuking a low hp carry when running or chasing. As well notice the rule for CD on her Q Beserk actually becomes stronger with level. The reduction decreases if you paid attention to the wording. The reduction goes down and therefore the damage goes up. As well this is like a stronger version of a 2.5 second fear or stun. [b]It actually causes them to be on your team[/b]and to do damage to their team [b]and therefore becomes targetable by enemy skillshots targetting and AOE[/b]. Mana cost was not included in the champ idea. She would use mana I just didn't feel like balancing the costs as well. Her ult is useful. You would just need to use is intelligently. when chasing an enemy grab them and pull them through a wall. The point is you wont always need a teammate to be invincible. Sometimes you just need to pull that last enemy through a wall keep him away from a turret. Heck you could just grab a carry pull them out and they are dead. It is useful in both ways. Try to think it through. As well its targetted so you really can't miss like blitzcrank. Supports generally dont need that much of an AP ration because of the builds they have to use sometimes. I would change the ratios if I felt they need buffing and I might after a close review. RIVER is a female character. Thanks for you concern over the champ idea though.[/quote]

[quote=Siridean]In that case, i would rename your berserk either a charm or a confuse if its attacking the enemy team. i still think it would be viable if it caused them to attack the nearest ally, especially in team fights. your tank initiates, then you berserk there carry. he uselessly beats on the tank while you kill him. as for Canaoas comment on his usefullness during both the laning and teamfight phases, i disagree . awesome during the laning phase, with a manaless poke and heal though not as usefull during team fights, because once your abilities are used up, your useless until your cd's refresh. which makes me think about the passive now, because it doesnt really help or support your team/ debuff the enemy, and your not tanking, granted it does allow you to survive long enough to fulfill ur role as support, imo i believe that there are more usefull alternatives. im assuming life stream channelled? ps, im really sorry about the amount of text, i just feel like this champion is super viable with a few tweeks.[/quote]

[quote=Siridean]another note on beserk... if ur essentially getting another teamate for the duration of the spell, making it weaker as the spell gets stronger, so people wont level it, because i would take 1.5 sec of 80% damage over the 50% and 2.5, dont mean to encroach on ur creativity, but a good fix for this would be either to make the % change static, or make the enemy attack an ally.[/quote]

[quote=Read]The way the beserk works is their damage when attacking an ally is reduced by 80%. This would similute a somewhat half-hearted attempt because they are forced to attack their own team. At max the damage is reduced BY not TO 40%. So that means it is actually reduced by less amount. 100 AD reduced by 80% = 20 AD. 100 AD reduced by 40% = 60 AD. The percentages are not the damage they are doing it is the amount that the damage is reduced by. Subtracting a negative makes it positive? Lifestream is not channeled. It would be considered a HoT (Healing over time) which acts exactly like a DoT. Instant cast but lasts a few seconds.[/quote]

[quote=Read]Reworked lifestream. Now does not have a scaling heal. Instead it reflects taken damage so that it will have a more useful fit into the kit while increasing the "offensive nature" of the support.[/quote]

[quote=Canoas]If you're going to let Q do damage or heal then each version would have to be weaker than others. Ah, I thought berserk would cause them to attack their enemy, so your ally. If you made berserk castable on allies too while increasing their damage it would be better. Right now it pales in comparison to other CC. You should also explain that you don't have mana costs because you haven't thought about them yet, I really thought it was like trynda and had no mana/energy/rage/whatever. Lifestream is better now. Considering it will cost mana. The AP ratio is very low though. Regarding the ulti, I just don't like it. I don't think it's very useful. Also, supports have pretty high AP ratios. usually close to 1.[/quote]

[quote=Siridean]ahh. i really need to read better. that makes much more sense with beserk. one final thing that i didnt notice about River's q... if the ally and enemy versions are each on there own separate CD, that essentially gives this champ five abilities, which just ain't right. someone brought up the point that you have to give up your heal for the damage, but thats not only fair, it requires you to think. kill my opponent? save my ally? and 2 heals still doesnt sitt well with me. maybe make life stream like a mini- Mundo ult. i like the reflection idea though. this is probably one of the best babysitting champs ive ever heard of.[/quote]

[quote=Tsunam1]I really like the concept of the ultimate and am truly suprised there's nothing like that (that I know of) that's implemented, nice work![/quote]