You really need to work on the info. And as I see it the "Alot of AP farming early game" will be hard since you rely on your CD and mana regen and still needing to survive, If you go mid you might have the HP issue but should be able to farm more or less unless they EXP-Block you . Top/Bot will be difficult since your team mate will not wait for you to cast your ability to AP farm while the other guys are pushing at you. My advise would be lvl 1 AP farm ability, lvl 2 Cage,and then rush your AP farm ability to 4 possibly 5 depending on how good/bad you are doing, Ignite worthless since you rely on NUKE. I would take tele and flash. Flash to get out of hot situations and tele to get back to your lane when needing to go b and restock on items. To sum it all up heres what I think you need.(Veigar is hard enough to get some gold on early lvls if you think you get 22g every 7 seconds won't be that effective)

-Defensive items early
-A more explained build and not just 5 rows of words
-Explain play style aggressive/defensive/solo/lane
-Re-think your item build and masteries

Thanks for reminding me, I actually do use 9/0/21 instead of 10/0/20 now (I had the extra point in the 10 AP for Ignite, but I don't really need that on Veigar).


And thus the experiment. MPen does work on people with no MR items, but I think the cheaper and faster farm is worth it. Actually, you could consider selling Lucidity boots and buying Sorcerer's Shoes for the extra ~300 gold later on, after you have enough gold/farm to buy a Deathfire Grasp. I might experiment with it more in the future and update.


I max dark matter first because it's your main damage dealing ability - Baleful Strike is just rushed in early game since the cooldown makes a real difference to your farm. Dark Matter is the 1:1 AP hits-like-a-truck BAM skill, and by mid game I need it for teamfights.

Oh yeah, I forgot you could do that whole build and not guide thing! :P

I think this build makes sense though since you're saying it's not about a lot of survivability, just some. I still think you should put 1 point of expanded mind into presence of the master, you just get SO little mana from expanded mind I think it would be worth it to have your cds up more.

I guess I am kind've sad you say you don't have to build magic pen because people in normals don't build MR, but you do have a point. I thought though if you got the straight magic pen it would affect people even without MR? I just bring this up cuz I am thinking of getting sorc shoes, but I see that the whole point of this build is to experiment with boots of lucidity, so that would be kind've silly to tell you to do.

I guess I think it's a good build, and I like how you max dark matter first which is different from me. Now I will try to remember a build is a build and a guide is a guide. Sorry for the confusion. +1

aah, that's my bad. I was thinking of how I play sona, and I removed Archangel's Staff from that build suggestion without removing the meki pendant. I was also entirely ignorant of Veigar's passive.

Thanks for the criticism. I realize now that I might have mis-named the guide a bit. I didn't intend for this to be a "tanky" Veigar build, I intended for it to be a Veigar build that won't allow him to be one-hit killed by a tank without sacrificing too much AP. This is what I usually play with ingame and I very rarely die on him due to positioning and well-placed stuns, but if I roll with 0 defensive items I get one-shotted by everybody.



Good suggestion. I actually do use Banshee's Veil in most of my games instead of Void Staff, but that's usually just because I don't have to get a Void Staff since nobody stacks magic resist in normal games.



I intend to leave that to the Veigar pros. I don't want to write a guide, at least not yet - I just wanted to get my prototype 1.0.0.108 build out there (the whole build was basically relying on an experiment to replace Deathfire Grasp by Ionian Boots of Lucidity and rush a Rabadon's Deathcap instead.



I will probably not be updating this any time soon so feel free to vote honestly. If the build deserves a -1, -1 it. Concerning 5k words, it's not a rule - it's just a cut-off differentiating builds between guides. All that will happen is my build not showing up in search results unless people tick "All", but that doesn't mean I can't write a build with less than 5k characters.



I need the ability power too - I'd rather one-shot the enemy carry than survive for 2 more seconds. I can't just focus purely on tank items, that's the tank's job.



It's an interesting idea, but I feel a lot of the money would be wasted on the cooldown reduction, even though you hit the cap without it. It also doesn't give me any flat mana. (for synergy with AAS)

I'll update the build's name, I didn't really intend to be a full-on tanky veigar, but rather a not-glass-cannon veigar (as opposed to building Rabadon's, DFG and AAS without any HP items at all like many people love to do).

Trojan, what exactly are you intending to put the Meki Pendant into? You know Soul Shroud builds from a Mana Manipulator right? :P Personally I would say a Banshee's Veil would be better than soul shroud still. Mp5 isn't too important for Veigar because of his passive, and he's already getting CDR from the boots and with golem he will be capped. Banshee's is better survivability too because of the magic resist and passive.

Have you considered using soul shroud? You could grab meki pendant as a first item, then rush soul shroud. Since veigar can get lots of AP without many items, you might want to exchange void staff for the soul shroud. This way you'll have over 1000 health early on. Also, Zhonya's Hourglass is a great item to get some armor, and Abyssal Mask is a great way to get some magic resist. So, to make an entirely non-squishy veigar, (and sorry to suggest an entirely different item build), maybe try this:

Meki Pendant
Soul Shroud
Ionian Boots of Lucidity
Rod of Ages
Rylai's Crystal Scepter
Abyssal Mask
Zhonya's Hourglass

Assuming the mobafire database is 100% correct, you'll have:

1830 health
925 Mana
12 Mana per 5
350 AP
50 Armor
57 Magic resist
30% cooldown
20 Spellpen
2 seconds of invulnerability

That's just from the items. Now the AP might seem like very little, but you're veigar: last hit like a boss and you'll be able to get another 100, 150 AP. If you feel like you could take one of those items out for a Rabadon's Deathcap, by all means do so, but you'll lose a significant amount of survivability in the process.

you have <2.5k HP until LATE game. if you even get there. VERY squishy.. sorry dude. -1

Still seems squishy to me >_> You only have one health / defensive item until your 5th item, and you don't have merc treads. Maybe use Banshee's Veil or Frozen Heart depending on team comp instead of Rabadon's? These items will also compliment your Archangel's.

Your description is pretty disappointing to say the least... I think you AT LEAST need to put in how playstyle differs from straight nuke veigar to a more survivable veigar. Is this recommended for beginning veigar players or advanced ones? When is non squishy veigar strongest (early/mid/late game?) What should non squishy veigar focus on doing in team fights?

Since you say he focuses a lot on ganking, maybe give a description on positioning / when to gank / what skills to use in what order?

I like the idea of a non-squishy veigar, and I know you can make good builds, but right now I would have to give a -1 the way it is. I am not going to vote yet and give you a chance to fix it though. The 5k words rule is there for a reason. :(