Is It Necessary to Remove Comment to Vote?

[quote=ap00pnugget]I was wondering what Mobafire's reason was for removing comment to vote at twenty votes, IMO it makes sure no one can troll. The only reason I can think of off the top of my head is that it makes sure people won't go downvote people that downvoted their builds. I don't have first hand experience, but I have recently read some interesting guides that were viable and had been downvoted because other people didn't want to compete with them. Any thoughts?[/quote]

[quote=Lugignaf]Reason we have C2V off at 20 votes: Look at most of the top guides. They are there because C2V was always on. They will almost never be removed from that position unless everyone goes to DV it. This prevented bad guides that were made early and made it to the top from ever getting down for fear of revenge votes.[/quote]

[quote=marisi]Still I agree with apoopnugget. I do think it should be atleast enlengthend a tiny bit. I love getting votes on my guide but it also terrifies me because it keeps pushing my guide to the barrier of 20 votes. It just ruines the amount of joy I get from receiving a vote.[/quote]

[quote=Beeswarm17]I think it's fine. I got most of the feedback I really needed in the early comments, and after that, I get more votes once C2V goes off. Sure, I've been hit with the Anonymous Suplex after it went off, but I'm getting just as many upvotes as down now. And marisi, I don't think changing the number of votes will change that feeling. Every comment you get will move you closer to the time when C2V goes off, no matter how many votes it takes for that to happen. Not every downvote is a troll vote, by the way. Maybe there's actually something wrong with your guide. Maybe they don't agree. Disagreement =/= bad player. At least not all the time. Best you can do is upvote the guides that deserve to be higher. There are plenty of people around here who will review your guide and provide feedback and solid comments. TL;DR: C2V is there so that guide writers can get some early feedback towards their guide. 20 votes is usually enough to get verbal feedback to solidify your guide. After that, it's open to the general public. Either be confident in your guide, or fix it up until you are.[/quote]

[quote=Calibern]I think it would be better if you had to comment to down vote. Anyone who down votes some ones hard work should at least give them a reason why they down voted. You don't really need to leave a comment on a up vote. I mean just knowing someone thought your guide was good enough to up vote is a comment in itself. This probably won't solve troll voting, but it will help some people get feedback on what they are doing wrong.[/quote]

[quote=Beeswarm17]No. Equal treatment for upvotes and downvotes. We don't need voting any more skewed than it already is. Requiring a comment for all downvotes isn't any different than requiring a comment for all votes. I don't see what the big deal about downvotes are. A downvote is worth just as much as an upvote. Someone can say, "nah, it's not that great" just as easily as someone can say, "yeah, that's pretty good". People have it in their minds that a downvote is someone's way of saying "your build is shit", while an upvote means "this is somewhat better than mediocre". It's not true. A downvote can mean "this could be better" or "this isn't as good as another build". If you get a downvote, figure out where you can improve. I've probably received a few downvotes on my guide since I still haven't been able to take the time to finish my mastery section. I'm not really worrying about it since I'll have to update the jungle section soon, too. But regardless, it's something I need to fix. There are plenty of places to get feedback from. There's no reason to have C2V on for longer than it already is.[/quote]

[quote=Calibern]Yea, but if a down voter leaves no comment then how can you improve your build. I have only section of my guide that I haven't finished. After that I won't know what to improve. It's the people who leave comments that let me know what works, and what doesn't. The up voters who have strong opinions leave their comments on how to improve. The down voter doesn't (after comment to vote is gone), because they saw a single thing they thought was wrong. I haven't had a down vote personally, but looking at other guides I can see that down voters don't usually leave comments . When they do, they usually say something like the champion is OP or why they would get a specific item. They may change their vote, but let's face it how many times have you looked at a guide you down voted weeks ago.[/quote]

[quote=Beeswarm17]And how many people do you think will just type in "your build sucks" and leave a comment? Is that constructive? If people are the type to comment anonymously, they're often not the type to leave any constructive criticism. There's nothing to stop them from typing in "..." and leaving a downvote, either. Put in a character limit? "......................................." will give them a vote. There is nothing in this world that can force constructive criticism. Nothing. Why require comments from people who won't leave any in the first place? People who will give their reasoning for their vote will comment no matter the system. Downvotes on my old guide ranged from long, well-reasoned arguments to short two word wastes of space. It all depends on the person. I actually haven't left many downvotes. The only times that I have have been if the guide was illegible to me. At that point, if they improved the writing enough for me to change it, they'd be better off archiving it and resubmitting it. If a guide has more than twenty votes, chances are my vote isn't going to change the outcome much. 4% is the most that I can possibly change it with a single vote. And that can be almost completely overturned with another upvote. My guide has been bouncing back and forth between 1st and 2nd place. Does that really matter to me? Not much. I know it's a good resource. Sometimes there isn't anything you can really do to change someone's mind. They believe that the build that they have in mind is better and that your build is simply inferior. Is it? Maybe. Doesn't matter. You could have scored 2 pentakills in ten games straight and have 2400 ELO, and they would still believe that they're better. They will still downvote. Bottom line: C2V is there to allow you to have a fighting chance in the early stages of voting before your guide has reached a stable position. Once you are there, guides are opened up to allow a broader audience to place your guide. Good guides can move up in the system, and a few downvotes won't change that.[/quote]

[quote=TheWeekndOVOXO]Yeah, I agree with Beeswarm. People will trollvote/downvote no matter what. You can't stop them, but what can counter it is people actually liking your build if it's worth the read/worth the vote. I really believe that the first 20 C2V are just a foreshadow of how your guide is after the 20 votes are over. If your guide is truly good, there must be no reason for people to downvote you (anonymously after the 20 C2Vs and unless they are trollvotes or people voting because they want their own build to be better). Honestly, I've read some builds that are in the 70%'s and they are: 1. Very well written 2. Clean and followed jhoijhoi's guide 3. Neatly done with cool templates 4. Full of information 5. Viable 6. Working 9/10 times I follow the guide Score means nothing sometimes. Sure, it feels good to see yourself with a big score, but I believe that keeping C2V forever is unnecessary. As much as I understand how dreadful it feels to have many downvotes without a valid reason, (or with trollvotes and people saying "LOLOLOL -1") it's just the way of life. Eventually, people will upvote it if they like it. For example, I haven't advertised my build at all, but I find my first guide alright. If you find your guide low on views, either change your tags or your title to be more "findable". I just try to go on google and write "Mobafire Jungle Fizz" and mine pops up first (last time I checked it out).[/quote]

[quote=Kazega]Look at my Katarina Guide for instance: it was sitting pretty at the #3 Kat guide on this site for a while and I was pretty happy about that but because I didn't use the Comment to Vote option, some people decided to troll vote me and I've sitting at the #11 spot ever since.... does it deserve it? Hell no. is it a good guide? I would like to think so but I have been trying to get advice and upvotes on all my guides because I would like to think I have good and Unique ideas that should be where people can see them. and that is something that I have been trying to promote.[/quote]