Ask a Diamond [Week 4: Mid lane]

[quote=Vynertje]The flair meta AFAIK had little to no impact on the mid meta. The only thing I could imagine is that mid laners would be forced to take strong lanes that can handle 1v1 because FF users can't gank as much as other junglers can. I doubt there will be much changes overall because immobile mid laners actually get shut down only harder by ganking junglers that use lizard, so having those rise in popularity won't affect those positively. Also, I forgot to post week 6 on wednesday. Will get to that ASAP.[/quote]

[quote=Relentless Logic]Yi q with red buff (almost) always guarantees a Flash from mid-laners. The same applies to FF Udyr. Regards, The Logician[/quote]

[quote=Vynertje][quote=Relentless Logic] Yi q with red buff (almost) always guarantees a Flash from mid-laners. The same applies to FF Udyr. Regards, The Logician [/quote] Uhm I don't know where you got that from but nope. As long as you don't overextend like a madman and stay patient (yes, this actually matters. People often flash in panic because they don't know how much damage they can and will take), you'll barely ever find any threat in a gank of these two. Assuming you're a ranged mid and the wave is in the perfect middle of the map, they won't be able to do a thing. They also can't do much if you ward one side and stick to that side for safety.[/quote]

[quote=NateDog13][quote=Vynertje] The flair meta AFAIK had little to no impact on the mid meta. The only thing I could imagine is that mid laners would be forced to take strong lanes that can handle 1v1 because FF users can't gank as much as other junglers can. I doubt there will be much changes overall because immobile mid laners actually get shut down only harder by ganking junglers that use lizard, so having those rise in popularity won't affect those positively. Also, I forgot to post week 6 on wednesday. Will get to that ASAP. [/quote] Little to no impact, really? Idk man, I think if anything it seems like it pushed out some of the more frequent picks like Ziggs out of general play, nowadays all I see are Ori, Leblanc, Lulu, and Soraka, can't tell you the last time I've seen any other champs mid. And in terms of what Relentless Logic said, instead of Yi or Udyr, how about Xin and Nocturne, the all in to win burst flare junglers, do you think they still had little to no impact on those choices Vyn?[/quote]

[quote=Barph][quote=NateDog13] Here's my question to all my Diamond peeps, and anyone else who would like to join in, now that feral flare is losing its *sunglasses* flair. Do you think more non-mobile mid picks are going to start seeing competitive play, like Syndra, Lux, Xerath, or will they still mostly stay out of view due to the already irritating to deal with spirit of the elder lizard junglers (Panth,Wu,etc.)? Or this flair meta still going to stay in place even after the nerfs? [/quote] The meta is never going to change thier playrates since the immobile mages are sort of niche in the sense that less people enjoy them compared to mobile champs. None of the immobile champs are even close to weak imo infact Syndra is OP as far as im concerned when it comes to laning. I personally main Vel'Koz(and Ahri) mid and the mobility lack on him is of no issue for me.[/quote]

[quote=Vynertje]Feral flare users don't gank mid very regularly because they need to farm. Xin is an odd pick because he's an early game jungler but makes good use of FF (however it's questionable whether he'll still be a good FF user after this patch). Since those FF users had little early game pressure it was actually a lot more rewarding to pick high pressure mids that could 1v1 their lane easily (which is why you see strong 1v1 champions in mid a lot). Champions with little mobility would actually get a more easy lane because all the assasins got nerfed in the past. With FF being nerfed and Lizard junglers coming back to play, farming is less rewarding and hence you might see a ([b]slight[/b] - FF is still a solid build path) increase in mid ganks and hence low-mobility champs falling slightly out of favor again. TLDR: If anything changes, it'll be an increase in mid ganks and the meta slightly adapting to deal with that increased pressure.[/quote]

[quote=NateDog13][quote=Vynertje] Feral flare users don't gank mid very regularly because they need to farm. Xin is an odd pick because he's an early game jungler but makes good use of FF (however it's questionable whether he'll still be a good FF user after this patch). Since those FF users had little early game pressure it was actually a lot more rewarding to pick high pressure mids that could 1v1 their lane easily (which is why you see strong 1v1 champions in mid a lot). Champions with little mobility would actually get a more easy lane because all the assasins got nerfed in the past. With FF being nerfed and Lizard junglers coming back to play, farming is less rewarding and hence you might see a ([b]slight[/b] - FF is still a solid build path) increase in mid ganks and hence low-mobility champs falling slightly out of favor again. TLDR: If anything changes, it'll be an increase in mid ganks and the meta slightly adapting to deal with that increased pressure. [/quote] Sounds good, also, I dont know if its just me, but I had seen a lot of nocturne ultimate mid ganks in high diamond play in ranked. It didn't seem to be that way for anyone other than Xin, and the occasional Yi mid cleanup.[/quote]

[quote=NateDog13][quote=Barph] [quote=NateDog13] Here's my question to all my Diamond peeps, and anyone else who would like to join in, now that feral flare is losing its *sunglasses* flair. Do you think more non-mobile mid picks are going to start seeing competitive play, like Syndra, Lux, Xerath, or will they still mostly stay out of view due to the already irritating to deal with spirit of the elder lizard junglers (Panth,Wu,etc.)? Or this flair meta still going to stay in place even after the nerfs? [/quote] The meta is never going to change thier playrates since the immobile mages are sort of niche in the sense that less people enjoy them compared to mobile champs. None of the immobile champs are even close to weak imo infact Syndra is OP as far as im concerned when it comes to laning. I personally main Vel'Koz(and Ahri) mid and the mobility lack on him is of no issue for me. [/quote] Idk about that one man, I'm a lover of Ziggs, but I hate having to deal with Nocturne, Xin, and Yi. This new meta turned me off from playing him mid, pretty much sticking to Leblanc and Yasuo.[/quote]

[quote=Vynertje][quote=NateDog13] [quote=Vynertje] Feral flare users don't gank mid very regularly because they need to farm. Xin is an odd pick because he's an early game jungler but makes good use of FF (however it's questionable whether he'll still be a good FF user after this patch). Since those FF users had little early game pressure it was actually a lot more rewarding to pick high pressure mids that could 1v1 their lane easily (which is why you see strong 1v1 champions in mid a lot). Champions with little mobility would actually get a more easy lane because all the assasins got nerfed in the past. With FF being nerfed and Lizard junglers coming back to play, farming is less rewarding and hence you might see a ([b]slight[/b] - FF is still a solid build path) increase in mid ganks and hence low-mobility champs falling slightly out of favor again. TLDR: If anything changes, it'll be an increase in mid ganks and the meta slightly adapting to deal with that increased pressure. [/quote] Sounds good, also, I dont know if its just me, but I had seen a lot of nocturne ultimate mid ganks in high diamond play in ranked. It didn't seem to be that way for anyone other than Xin, and the occasional Yi mid cleanup. [/quote] That probably still happens but kill potential is still quite low (relative to other junglers like Pantheon, Wukong, Jarvan at 6) because he needs time (and thus distance - mid is a shorter lane as you obviously know) for his fear to go off. As long as you're not overextended hard without ANY escape at all (whether that be heal, flash or a standard dash). His after-6 ganks are more effective bot IMO but I'm not such a great noct player myself. Not to forget that he has 0 pressure pre-6 at all. On that note I think it'd be good to close this thread since I was already delayed with the week-5 thread and move on to that one. Mods pls lockerino[/quote]