I'm diamond1 with only ~60 total solo queue...

[quote=FalseoGod]Wasn't exactly a comment on those two being op, rather the "Rawr Elo Hell - Play better champs" comment. Although Ryze had a pretty decent strong-and-stupid phase. Wasn't even complaining or anything, just a statement :v[/quote]

[quote=SkidmarkD][quote=throatslasher] Like, 80% of my games were ryze and shen. If you call those OPs, then I feel bad for you son [/quote] Having recently started playing [[shen]], I feel he's strong. Granted I'm still very new to him and still trying various things to see if/how they work, but if you stick to what you know to work, you can wreck the enemy team. [[ryze]] on the other hand is currently suffering from his nerf. Can't say he feels as strong as he used to. Also, no [[riven]]? Feel like she's the current must play champ to shoot from bronze to gold/plat the fastest.....[/quote]

[quote=C4 Lasty]Shen is a tier 1 top laner. He's very strong but only in really skilled hands. Riven loses to the 3 tier 1 tops. Renekton, Shen, and Jax. You're asking for trouble first picking Riven right now.[/quote]

[quote=SEALynx]60 games and already in diamond 1? You automatically have my respect. Oh, and what do you think about Shen against jax toplane if both are of equal skill?[/quote]

[quote=SkidmarkD][quote=C4 Lasty] Shen is a tier 1 top laner. He's very strong but only in really skilled hands. Riven loses to the 3 tier 1 tops. Renekton, Shen, and Jax. You're asking for trouble first picking Riven right now. [/quote] Tier lists can be ignored completely in bronze/silver/lower gold. Riven is similar to Yi. In lower elo's they snowball incredibly easy and can solo carry games.[/quote]

[quote=Pølsemanden]@Lasty How does riven lose to jax and shen? I know she doesn't stomp them, but she hardly loses to anyone but renekton. @SkidmarkD Saying to disregard tierlists is completely moronic, tier lists apply to any elo, some champions might be higher/lower in certain elo's but the lists still apply. As an example i'd never play Miss fortune in a bronze game and she's practically the only ad-carry i can play but she needs a team that understands the fact that a no-dash ad-carry needs to be protected almost to the point where she can just stand still and kill stuff.[/quote]

[quote=SkidmarkD]The tier lists are based on many factors. The inherent capabilities of the champion, synergy with the team, synergy with the current meta, etc. These factors aren't the same in lower elo's. Your point even supports this statement. Many champions might be top tier, but they still need a functional team to make a difference. If your team doesn't know your champ, the pro's and con's, then you can even be god tier and still get raped. In many games people pick a certain champion because he's tier 1. Then feeds and throws the game. The same when people pick a counter just to counter. It's not that the tier list doesn't exist in low elo's, it's just that the players themselves render it useless.[/quote]

[quote=Pølsemanden]You're gonna have a lot better of a shot at winning a game with VI jungle than with Maokai or Shyvana jungle, doesn't matter if you're diamond or bronze.[/quote]

[quote=Vynertje][quote=Pølsemanden] You're gonna have a lot better of a shot at winning a game with VI jungle than with Maokai or Shyvana jungle, doesn't matter if you're diamond or bronze. [/quote] You're definitely underestimating shyvana's potential there. Even though I agree with the point you're trying to make, you should never force yourself into stuff you don't feel comfortable with just because they are FOTM.[/quote]

[quote=SkidmarkD][[Master Yi]] And I rest my case.[/quote]