The hardest stomps I've seen are from 
Riven. If there was ever a champion that was designed to show you that you can get to Diamond on mechanics alone, it's this *****. The snowball is so ridiculous at low Elo. I can't play her at all, though, lol.
The other is probably Lee Sin for me. My Diamond friend I keep mentioning would play these two if he was trying to win in champ select.
Of course, that's quite boring, so we would usually play something not-so-tryhard like Soraka and Lulu botlane.
Riven. If there was ever a champion that was designed to show you that you can get to Diamond on mechanics alone, it's this *****. The snowball is so ridiculous at low Elo. I can't play her at all, though, lol.The other is probably
Lee Sin for me. My Diamond friend I keep mentioning would play these two if he was trying to win in champ select.Of course, that's quite boring, so we would usually play something not-so-tryhard like
Soraka and Lulu botlane.
Embracing wrote:
since i can't be bothered to respond to everything:
1) You don't need to be diamond to animation cancel
2) moat low ~ mid diamonds can't animation cancel
1) You don't need to be diamond to animation cancel
2) moat low ~ mid diamonds can't animation cancel
You just contradicted yourself.
Quoted:
You seem to have a misconception that only pros or high diamonds can carry through low elo.
I never once said that. I just pointed out that just because a high diamond CAN do it, doesn't mean its easy or that anyone could do it. Otherwise 70% of LoL players wouldn't be lower than gold.
Quoted:
To conclude this stupid argument:
And there is your problem.
1) Its not an argument its a dialogue.
2) You are clearly hostile. A classic LTFP trope.
3) Your only contribution, paraphrasing "Its ****ing easy to carry teams, just do it, or shut the **** up"
4) I guess you missed the 20 times I said I don't believe in ELO hell. Not once did I blame a team for losses, I just said "I'm not good enough to carry a bad team" <--- Its on me "I", not "they".
Quoted:
then you belong at your rank. That's how the ******** ladder system works at EVERY RANK
I never said I didn't.
1) I have moved up steadily and feel like I am helping my teams win.
2) The only thing I have ever questioned is why people who CS at a bronze V level are doing in Silver.
In summary,
Don't assume everyone struggling to get better at the game is blaming their teammates, which is clearly what you did there. I don't even believe in ELO hell as in "my I would be higher ranked but my teamates make me lose"
The most common thing I type in chat is (After people start raging about bad players):
"Its ok, we just have to carry them." "We got this, don't worry about (players name), lets just win and get on to the next game."
LoL has the reputation as the worst gaming community on earth --- so stop contributing to it by ****ting all over the dialogue between a low level and higher level players.
General reply to Utopus and Sirrel,
There are millions and millions of LoL players --- that is the aggregate.
You guys continue to use anecdotal evidence to support an aggregate claim.
You can list 1000 people who went from Silver to Diamond in one season and its still statistically insignificant and proves nothing.
For every 500,000 poor people in the USA -- somebody gets rich by being good at sports. It doesn't mean that sports is the key to getting out of poverty. Or lottery tickets, or having a rich uncle die...
The very indisputable fact that 70% of LoL players are lower than gold proves that its not easy to reach gold. I recently watched an hour long video of longshadow9 (Pro team coach) and he pointed out something simple that nobody in this thread mentioned:
Pick easier to play and over powered champs. IE, if your silver don't play Syndra - because syndra has a high skill cap.
In none of his videos does he ever say "DUh just player better, its easy, I could do it"
Anecdotal evidence is not evidence. Or for those of you who have taken Logic.
I saw a blue swan once, therefore swans are blue. Logical Fallacy.
I used to care about KDA, now I care about CS and Objectives.
Ixtellor wrote:
You just contradicted yourself.
No, he didn't. It is not mutually exclusive. It can be the case that people who are lower than Diamond can animation cancel AND it can also be the case that mid-low Diamonds can't animation cancel. These can both be true at the same time. You don't need animation cancelling to be Diamond, but it doesn't mean that being able to animation cancel automatically makes you Diamond.
Ixtellor wrote:
I never once said that. I just pointed out that just because a high diamond CAN do it, doesn't mean its easy or that anyone could do it. Otherwise 70% of LoL players wouldn't be lower than gold.
That's an implied fallacy in itself. Just because 70% of players are lower than gold, doesn't mean you have to be that 70%. And the percentages literally mean **** all when you isolate them from yourself. If you keep crunching numbers like that, saying, 'oh, I can't get any higher', then no wonder you're going to be stuck in the 70%. There's also no reason why that percentage has to remain static either and it hasn't. The distribution has shifted towards higher and higher Elo each year.
Ixtellor wrote:
And there is your problem.
1) Its not an argument its a dialogue.
2) You are clearly hostile. A classic LTFP trope.
3) Your only contribution, paraphrasing "Its ****ing easy to carry teams, just do it, or shut the **** up"
4) I guess you missed the 20 times I said I don't believe in ELO hell. Not once did I blame a team for losses, I just said "I'm not good enough to carry a bad team" <--- Its on me "I", not "they".
1) It can be a dialogue AND an argument. Again, these two aren't exclusive.
2) He's not hostile, but he's certainly annoyed. To us, all the things you are saying just sound like petty excuses to stall your own improvement.
3) That's what I've been saying too.
4) That is NOT what you have been saying nor implying. You have CONSTANTLY been blaming your team or at least implying it.
Ixtellor wrote:
I never said I didn't.
1) I have moved up steadily and feel like I am helping my teams win.
2) The only thing I have ever questioned is why people who CS at a bronze V level are doing in Silver.
2) This is basically blaming your team. And as I said, Silver is no different from Bronze.
Ixtellor wrote:
In summary,
Don't assume everyone struggling to get better at the game is blaming their teammates, which is clearly what you did there. I don't even believe in ELO hell as in "my I would be higher ranked but my teamates make me lose"
But that's exactly what you've been saying, though (see above and basically all your other posts, lol). You've complaining about a slow grind and one of the most common reasons you've given is because of 'people who CS at Bronze V level' and the like.
Ixtellor wrote:
The most common thing I type in chat is (After people start raging about bad players):
"Its ok, we just have to carry them." "We got this, don't worry about (players name), lets just win and get on to the next game."
LoL has the reputation as the worst gaming community on earth --- so stop contributing to it by ****ting all over the dialogue between a low level and higher level players.
Embracing has VERY valid points and they are essentially a summary of everything I've been saying. Just because he sounds so frustrated over your Silver rank logic doesn't mean he's '****ting' on the discussion.
Ixtellor wrote:
There are millions and millions of LoL players --- that is the aggregate.
You guys continue to use anecdotal evidence to support an aggregate claim.
Hold the ****ing phone. Answer me this: If >>>I<<< can do it, why can't you? Why the **** must constantly hide behind 'statistics' and imply 'I can't do it because other people can't do it'? How do you explain that I got from Bronze/Silver to Plat? Like, I don't think you're dumb, but if you're trying to argue with logic, your logic is just clearly flawed.
If your best answer to 'If I and others can do it, why can't you?' is 'it's anecdotal evidence, it doesn't count as -real- evidence', then you failed to even answer the question. The actual answer is: 'You don't know how and you are evidently too scared to ask how'.
Literally, the resources are right here in order for you to progress quicker at the game, but you just seem to be more preoccupied with coming up with reasons why you can't do it. 'I'm gold standard and steadily getting there' - HOMIE, you got like 3-4 people in this thread alone who can teach you things to rapidly improve. Okay, maybe I exaggerate here because not all improvement is instantly apparent.
Ixtellor wrote:
You can list 1000 people who went from Silver to Diamond in one season and its still statistically insignificant and proves nothing.
For every 500,000 poor people in the USA -- somebody gets rich by being good at sports. It doesn't mean that sports is the key to getting out of poverty. Or lottery tickets, or having a rich uncle die...
For every 500,000 poor people in the USA -- somebody gets rich by being good at sports. It doesn't mean that sports is the key to getting out of poverty. Or lottery tickets, or having a rich uncle die...
Well, that's a tangent and a half, but oh well. Okay sure, let's go by statistics. Why don't you be that 1 out of 500,000 then? Because you're too busy making excuses, that's why.
Ixtellor wrote:
The very indisputable fact that 70% of LoL players are lower than gold proves that its not easy to reach gold. I recently watched an hour long video of longshadow9 (Pro team coach) and he pointed out something simple that nobody in this thread mentioned:
Pick easier to play and over powered champs. IE, if your silver don't play Syndra - because syndra has a high skill cap.
In none of his videos does he ever say "DUh just player better, its easy, I could do it"
Anecdotal evidence is not evidence. Or for those of you who have taken Logic.
I saw a blue swan once, therefore swans are blue. Logical Fallacy.
*Lastshadow9
And you completely miss the point of that part of his video, as well as the fact that he essentially agrees with us and not you. But let's address some other serious issues with some things that you've just said.
1) In 2013, 85% of players were Silver and under. If by 2014-5, only 70% of players are Silver and under, then it shows it's really not that ****ing hard to get better at the game.
2) You're using the inferential fallacy wrong. What we are saying is, 'I saw someone do a double backflip once, so I trained and did a double backflip too; my friend saw it, trained and did a triple backflip'. Or to put it into LoL terms - 'I saw someone get Diamond once, therefore it should be possible for me too'.
So what Lastshadow is ACTUALLY saying is that players in low Elo are trying to use a champion WITHOUT KNOWING HOW THE CHAMPION WORKS (
Zed, Azir, Lulu etc). Players are using champions with skillshots without knowing how to even aim properly ( Syndra, Ezreal, Thresh, etc). And similar other kind of problems.To advance in the game, you have to be able to understand what your champion does. As a result, lower tier players should begin with lower skillcap champions, like
Janna, Annie, Ryze, etc. Lower skillcap = easier understanding = easier not to make mistakes in-game, and also because players just don't understand the champions. He also said that you can get to Diamond with mechanics alone, but most of us don't have the mechanics, so what is he telling us to concentrate on? Game KNOWLEDGE; how the game works and what you should be doing. In other words, the things that 100% of all Silver and below players don't understand. It's not as simple as, 'pick easy and OP champions'.Above all, the first and foremost thing that Nick emphasises that he is teaching is the CORRECT MINDSET to improve, which you seem to evidently be missing.
If anything, I'm surprised that you, having watched the video, left out that Nick says that Elo Hell doesn't exist, that you can't consistently place the burden of responsibility for losing on your team. The first and final reason why you move up and down the ranking ladder is yourself only.
sirell wrote:
That's an implied fallacy in itself. Just because 70% of players are lower than gold, doesn't mean you have to be that 70%. And the percentages literally mean **** all when you isolate them from yourself. If you keep crunching numbers like that, saying, 'oh, I can't get any higher', then no wonder you're going to be stuck in the 70%. There's also no reason why that percentage has to remain static either and it hasn't. The distribution has shifted towards higher and higher Elo each year.
1) I have never once said I can't get higher. Stop repeating this lie.
2)I am just saying, getting to diamond is a lot harder than you are making it out to be. Why you fail to grasp that concept is insane. If getting to Diamond was as easy as play better, then a lot more people would be diamond. Do you think that 70& of people who play Ranked aren't trying to get better?
Then you prove my point that mention that it used to be 85% and now its 70% --- HENCE people are trying to get better and succeeding.
Quoted:
2) He's not hostile, but he's certainly annoyed. To us, all the things you are saying just sound like petty excuses to stall your own improvement.
Question: Why the hell would anyone be annoyed at a person who DOES take responsibility for their rank but still has questions?
Answer: Because you have an automatic response to **** on players and assume they are blaming their teammates even when they explicitly say they aren't blaming their teammates.
Quoted:
3) That's what I've been saying too.
Yes you suffer from LTP syndrome. IE What makes LoL the most unpopular gaming community on earth.
Quoted:
4) That is NOT what you have been saying nor implying. You have CONSTANTLY been blaming your team or at least implying it.
1) Not once ever have I said "its my teams fault" or "I would be X rank if it wasn't for my team".
2) You can simultaneously mention that some people don't know what they are doing and NOT blame them.
I have never responded to any of your points about you get good teams and bad teams because its so obvious. Yes 50% of the time I will get a bad team and 50% as good one --- DUH.
I 100% understand that I am the only constant. When my team loses, there is something I could have done different to make it a win. When my team loses, its because I lacked the ability to carry.
I have been crystal clear that I don't believe in ELO HELL.
I can't not be any more concise. The fact I point out bad players doesnt' mean they caused the loss --- as you have stated 50% of your teammates are awful --- all I did was wonder why some of them are so bad why others are so good yet we are all in the same rank.
Quoted:
Quoted:
2) This is basically blaming your team. And as I said, Silver is no different from Bronze.
I HAVE TO CARRY THEM. Again, you have stated half your teams are bad --- all I did was repeat that. And since your not blaming your team, IM NOT BLAMING my team.
Quoted:
You've complaining about a slow grind and one of the most common reasons you've given is because of 'people who CS at Bronze V level' and the like.
Wrong -- I stated over and over and over "I'm not good enough to consistently carry those games (50% by your own words) where my team has the bronze V CS'er on it"
Notice the key words "I'm not good enough".
I have problem typed that phrase 50 times now. But your LTP beer googles always edits it to "my team prevents me from climbing"
Me "I'm not good enough"
You "Stop blaming your team"
WTF?!?
Quoted:
Embracing has VERY valid points and they are essentially a summary of everything I've been saying. Just because he sounds so frustrated over your Silver rank logic doesn't mean he's '****ting' on the discussion.
Because he isn't reacting to what I'm saying he, AND YOU, are reacting to your own bias -- which never appear in the actual discussion taking place.
Quoted:
Hold the ****ing phone. Answer me this: If >>>I<<< can do it, why can't you?
How is that any ****ing different than "If an NBA player can do it, why can't you?"
I don't know you. I don't know why your a top 5% player. Maybe your extra dextrous, maybe you have a solid stable of duo partners, maybe you never forget to use your items, maybe you have good mehcanics, or map awareness, or whatever the 10,000 other variables might be.
Quoted:
Why the **** must constantly hide behind 'statistics'
Look at the number of views of LoL tutorials. Clearly a lot of people ARE trying and aren't making it.
Quoted:
'I can't do it because other people can't do it'? How do you explain that I got from Bronze/Silver to Plat? Like, I don't think you're dumb, but if you're trying to argue with logic, your logic is just clearly flawed.
Because I never said that. Strawman.
The fact other people can't make diamond has nothing to do with me. It's just evidence that "IT ISN'T EASY TO GET ABOVE GOLD"
Why you refuse to accept its difficult to get into platinum is beyond insane.
Your response "But jim did it, therefore its easy" <--- logical fallacy.
Quoted:
'You don't know how and you are evidently too scared to ask how'.
Literally, the resources are right here in order for you to progress quicker at the game, but you just seem to be more preoccupied with coming up with reasons why you can't do it.
Literally, the resources are right here in order for you to progress quicker at the game, but you just seem to be more preoccupied with coming up with reasons why you can't do it.
The only excuse I have ever given is "I'm not good enough to consistently carry teams at my rank".
Quoted:
Well, that's a tangent and a half, but oh well. Okay sure, let's go by statistics. Why don't you be that 1 out of 500,000 then? Because you're too busy making excuses, that's why.
Maybe my fingers are too fat, maybe I have a slow computer, maybe my brain is incapable of processing information fast enough, maybe my wife threatened to divorce me if I play more than 4 games a week, maybe I suffer from nacrolepsy --- none of these are true. But there are literally thousands of reasons of why a person may not reach the top 1%. Exactly like every sport on earth.
By your logic, why aren't you on team CLG?
Your logic "To busy making excuses not to be!"
Quoted:
So what Lastshadow is ACTUALLY saying is that players in low Elo are trying to use a champion WITHOUT KNOWING HOW THE CHAMPION WORKS ( Zed, Azir, Lulu etc). Players are using champions with skillshots without knowing how to even aim properly ( Syndra, Ezreal, Thresh, etc). And similar other kind of problems.
Zed, Azir, Lulu etc). Players are using champions with skillshots without knowing how to even aim properly ( Syndra, Ezreal, Thresh, etc). And similar other kind of problems.I didn't miss the point of the video, I just didn't want to continue typing a novel.
Quoted:
It's not as simple as, 'pick easy and OP champions'.
Again, I get what he was saying, I was just being miserly with word count.
Quoted:
Above all, the first and foremost thing that Nick emphasises that he is teaching is the CORRECT MINDSET to improve, which you seem to evidently be missing.
You make it sound like his coaching strategy is believing in yourself. I have watched a lot of his videos and I get what he is teaching.
Quoted:
If anything, I'm surprised that you, having watched the video, left out that Nick says that Elo Hell doesn't exist, that you can't consistently place the burden of responsibility for losing on your team. The first and final reason why you move up and down the ranking ladder is yourself only.
Which is exactly what I have been saying for 5 pages now. You just refuse to read my words.
Number of times I said its my teams fault: 0
The number of times I said it was my fault: 43 (Thats a slightly hyperbolic guess, but the point stands)
Number of times I have mentioned I have bad teams = to the number of times you have said "you are going to have bad teams". Mentioning bad teams is a reality, half your teams are bad and half are good. Stating a fact doesn't equate to blaming.
I used to care about KDA, now I care about CS and Objectives.
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