Dune0z wrote:
It's been a season, But I've got back into the support role. It's my favorite and most loved role. I have a question though, How do you "trust" ADC's in SoloQue? I fear I have a bad mindset where I always get a "bad apple". Any tips for an aspiring support main? It'd be much appreciated ^-^
Even tough this is Vynertje's thread, I'm pretty sure that the mindset is a thing that only you can improve. Just play cool and start focusing in your game and list your errors instead of your teammates' and you'll be fine.
Dune0z wrote:
It's been a season, But I've got back into the support role. It's my favorite and most loved role. I have a question though, How do you "trust" ADC's in SoloQue? I fear I have a bad mindset where I always get a "bad apple". Any tips for an aspiring support main? It'd be much appreciated ^-^
Good question! I'd agree it's mostly a mindset thing that you have to have to change yourself, but a few things to keep in mind:
1. Keep in mind that everyone at your rating is there for a reason (the amount of boosted players is far lower than people think it is). Therefore, you should always start from the assumption that everyone is as good as you until proven otherwise. Just as importantly, one game or one highlight is not 'a large enough sample size' to say someone is bad or good.
2. Generally, I find it relatively easy to recognize whether someone is an ADC main or not. Although you may not find this as easy, it is important to know whether someone is confident in his role or not and you should try to adapt your playstyle accordingly. The player may be a bad ADC, but generally they will still be decent players.
3. Your own perception of the players around you is often very coloured. Looking at it from a slightly more scientific point of view, your mind only records the stand-out moments (usually the negative highlights) and quickly forgets all the other things happening around you. Chances are you are recording that one time the ADC got caught and gave up two kills, but you may not even have noticed the small trades he won that you perhaps should have capitalized on.
But why is this important, you may ask. This means that your mind has a tendency to believe you often have those "rotten apples", as you call them yourself. However, instead you're just selectively picking moments that give a distorted view.
4. As theyouiporit states, you cannot make your team play better. Even if a player is genuinely bad, the only thing you can do is to play in the most optimal way given the circumstance. I'd say about 75% of the games you play it doesn't really matter what you do - given you do not **** up too much yourself. It is about winning those 25% which you CAN influence. Therefore it is important to just ignore what other players do and always try to go for the most optimal moves for your situation. While this may not make you 'trust' your ADC, it will make you think less about your ADC. I personally try to never actively trust or distrust my teammates and just do my best.
Thank you so much for the thought out reply, this is going to line right up with thinking about improving and doing my best, rather then worrying for how the game turns out in the end. Now all I have to do is practice and train it, You're really an inspiration, Keep on carrying, you give me hope that supports are just as good as carrying as any other role. x3
Vynertje wrote:
Why not? If you're having success and enjoying playing him that's all you should care about.
actually I don't enjoy playing Thresh every game into every comp. But I feel like if I play another champion and can't carry that's gona suck.
hypershatter wrote:
actually I don't enjoy playing Thresh every game into every comp. But I feel like if I play another champion and can't carry that's gona suck.
As I wrote above, you shouldn't force yourself into a situation where you feel like you have to carry each game. I play Janna about every game I can get her as support, not to single-handedly carry games but instead to push those close games over the edge and get us the win that way. I don't look at the game from a "did I carry the game?" standpoint but rather "did I do what I was supposed to do this game?" - if the answer to each game you play is "yes" you'll find yourself winning/climbing eventually, regardless of whether you actually carried or not.
Vynertje wrote:
As I wrote above, you shouldn't force yourself into a situation where you feel like you have to carry each game. I play Janna about every game I can get her as support, not to single-handedly carry games but instead to push those close games over the edge and get us the win that way. I don't look at the game from a "did I carry the game?" standpoint but rather "did I do what I was supposed to do this game?" - if the answer to each game you play is "yes" you'll find yourself winning/climbing eventually, regardless of whether you actually carried or not.
Hmm does Janna work in low gold? I can't really trust my carries to farm properly to be worth peeling at that elo.
hypershatter wrote:
Hmm does Janna work in low gold? I can't really trust my carries to farm properly to be worth peeling at that elo.
There will always be someone worth peeling for, if there isn't the game is lost anyway no matter what you pick.
Janna in a way works through un-****ing the ****ups of your team. You'll be able to prevent that ADC or midlaner from dying to assassins every time. You will not hard carry each game, but you can push these close games over the edge easily.
I'm not saying Janna is the best pick in the game, but you shouldn't dismiss a champion because it doesn't have a carry-oriented playstyle. All that matters in the long run is whether it will make you win more games than lose, and Janna will certainly do that if you're good at her.
Hey Guys,
I have a question: I have around 54% winrate with Thresh in ranked in around 40 games, Im currently in Silver 5 with 59 lp because i lost my last 4 games. I want to improve so i can learn from my mistakes, do u guys have any advice for support regarding:
1. Minion manipulation: When i should freeze the lane
2. When i can engage and when not in the laning phase
Thanks in advance!
Greetings,
EricboyZ
I have a question: I have around 54% winrate with Thresh in ranked in around 40 games, Im currently in Silver 5 with 59 lp because i lost my last 4 games. I want to improve so i can learn from my mistakes, do u guys have any advice for support regarding:
1. Minion manipulation: When i should freeze the lane
2. When i can engage and when not in the laning phase
Thanks in advance!
Greetings,
EricboyZ
EricboyZ wrote:
Hey Guys,
I have a question: I have around 54% winrate with Thresh in ranked in around 40 games, Im currently in Silver 5 with 59 lp because i lost my last 4 games. I want to improve so i can learn from my mistakes, do u guys have any advice for support regarding:
1. Minion manipulation: When i should freeze the lane
2. When i can engage and when not in the laning phase
Thanks in advance!
Greetings,
EricboyZ
I have a question: I have around 54% winrate with Thresh in ranked in around 40 games, Im currently in Silver 5 with 59 lp because i lost my last 4 games. I want to improve so i can learn from my mistakes, do u guys have any advice for support regarding:
1. Minion manipulation: When i should freeze the lane
2. When i can engage and when not in the laning phase
Thanks in advance!
Greetings,
EricboyZ
1. Generally I would advice against freezing at lower ratings unless you're absolutely 100% sure how it works and that you can execute it properly. Chances are you'll do more harm than you actually realize because either you or your ADC did not grasp some of the difficult parts of setting up and maintaining a freeze. The difference between a freezing wave and a slow-pushing wave is very small, and creating a slow-push wave is often the worst of your options.
2. I assume you mean "When can I engage during and outside of laning phase?", I hope I understand it correctly.
As always with such generic questions, there is no clear cut answer. Instead, I will mention a few things that will increase or decrease the chances of you winning a fight/trade;
Factors that increase the chance of winning a trade/fight:
1. you have a large minion wave on your side: fighting inside a minion wave will cause the enemy to take extra creep damage. This is particularly relevant in laning phase
2. when you have a (summoner) spell advantage, i.e. when you know bot lane has no flashes or when Blitzcrank just used his Q but missed.
3. when you have an item or level lead
4. when you are aware of the enemy's position in order to avoid getting collapsed upon by the jungler/mid laner
Some more specific for mid/late game teamfights:
5. When you are ahead of the enemy in one way or another
6. If one of your enemies is out of position (very common in solo queue; ward well and try to move around smartly and you'll easily find picks)
7. When you have wards around the area you're planning to fight
Some things that may cause you to lose a trade:
1. When you have summoners/main abilities down
2. When you know the enemy has TP ready and you're engaging 2v2 without backup, especially when your own top/mid does not have it ready; especially important when playing vs shen/twisted fate/pantheon (also stealth champions like evelynn, stealth essentially works like a global pressure mechanic; unless you know where she is you should be more careful)
3. Not having any vision of the jungler
4. Fighting in a large enemy minion wave or with a level/item disadvantage
Particularly in late game:
5. When you have no way of getting to priority targets and can't blow up the enemy front line early in the fight (often lines up with being behind in items/gold)
6. When there are waves pushing into you; chances are you may win the fight but you may lose towers or not get anything from it. Especially when there is a split pusher on the enemy team you should be more careful
7. When your team relies on splitpushing rather than 5v5 fights (particularly important when you have champions like Fiora who are better off in a 1v1 scenario) or when you have worse tools for 5v5 fights in general
8. When you are not grouped up with all 5: DO NOT engage unless you're 100% sure the enemy cannot bring a fifth man into the fight (i.e. through tp's or being close by to join)
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