NA -- SR -- 7/28/2012 -- 500 wins and below ONLY

[quote=BarbJ]Lee Sin has the ganking potential you need with today's meta, along with CC (knock back, slow), utility (mobility, shield, sustain). He's my top pick, but Nautilus (if he's not banned) is second. I don't know if you guys have seen tier lists before, but they tend to show you everything that you need to know: http://www.reignofgaming.net/tier-lists/jungle-tier-list/21104-jungle-tier-list-zyra-era "The obvious Mundo and Nocturne (due to tournament player) are there as well as Nautilus (for teams) and Olaf for counter picking-jungle carry status. Lee Sin is always a safe one while Udyr tends to be binary depending on the competency of your team. When all else fails - pick the all purpose Jarvan."[/quote]

[quote=Arkharan][quote=ShoreXShot] I am beginning to think that taking a different jungle to in-houses might be needed. [/quote] The problem is not behing you picking olaf but your team lacking an initiate. If you want to play olaf with a good team sinergy, you'd need a top lane champion like malphite or wukong (could be another top that can engage), something like morgana/kennen mid or ashe / sona / alistar bot. You should not be giving up on olaf, but you definetly need a good initiate on your team to play him. Also for the part where I helped you bot, I really enjoyed doing so. ^^[/quote]

[quote=JEFFY40HANDS][quote=BarbJ] Lee Sin has the ganking potential you need with today's meta, along with CC (knock back, slow), utility (mobility, shield, sustain). He's my top pick, but Nautilus (if he's not banned) is second. I don't know if you guys have seen tier lists before, but they tend to show you everything that you need to know: http://www.reignofgaming.net/tier-lists/jungle-tier-list/21104-jungle-tier-list-zyra-era "The obvious Mundo and Nocturne (due to tournament player) are there as well as Nautilus (for teams) and Olaf for counter picking-jungle carry status. Lee Sin is always a safe one while Udyr tends to be binary depending on the competency of your team. When all else fails - pick the all purpose Jarvan." [/quote] Nocturne is probably one of the easier jungles to get the hang of and his ganks are amazing. @shore: i wasnt intending to make you think you need to play other junglers, olaf is a solid pick. But it needs to fit the team comp better...as was already said. All in all im happy to see people enjoyed the inhouses, and the cnc was helpful.[/quote]

[quote=iownedya][quote=Psychofrench] The 3rd video was interesting. Its awesome to be able to get back and see what I did and how. Ill definitively think about it next time I play. And I enjoyed my last Galio ultimate, it might have looked like a miss but I saw Pantheon initiating and when his team didn't follow I pretty much popped it in between to keep them from jumping in. I'm really hoping to participate again. [/quote] I hate you galio....[/quote]

[quote=Psychofrench]His ganks weren't that bad, I just think we kinda failed bottom to follow on it (I really need to work on that as shown with my Nasus top) especially since I had Blitz and could have grabbed them as they were running away. I have never tried jungle, it does seem a tad boring to me.[/quote]

[quote=Psychofrench][quote=iownedya] [quote=Psychofrench] The 3rd video was interesting. Its awesome to be able to get back and see what I did and how. Ill definitively think about it next time I play. And I enjoyed my last Galio ultimate, it might have looked like a miss but I saw Pantheon initiating and when his team didn't follow I pretty much popped it in between to keep them from jumping in. I'm really hoping to participate again. [/quote] I hate you galio.... [/quote] I literally told my team that I was expecting you to rape my ass top lane. You had an awesome game though.[/quote]

[quote=ShoreXShot]I main Noct while Olaf is normally my second pick(lee is third due to ping issues which can really hurt him) each of which I have a rather high win rate in ranked. The problem with nocturne though is he requires slightly tanky team even though I build as a tank. So he suffers from the same issues as Olaf. I would put their CC and ganks about on par(pre 6 maybe 11) as Noct's fear isn't consistent. While noct will have his nice gap closer once he hits six, proper warding can let you know he is coming with the exception of two jump spots that to be honest should be warded when you have a nocturne on the opposing team. Once he hits level 11 his ganks really shine thanks to the range boost and wards becoming futile for ganks. His problems come into late game which I will discuss later. Olaf has a much better team fight, counter jungling, and late game due to his ulti which can suck up a lot of the opposing teams cc while you are taking out the carry. Late game with nocturne makes you a tanky assassin where you have to enter a little later as no matter how tanky you are the CC will end you and it will quickly turn into a 4v5 in their favor. This having few exceptions such as Morgana who can use your blind efficiently. Lee Sin has a strong jungle but falls off hard late game as he really doesn't have much team fight ability.... You have your kick that can send their carry to your team but normally it can be very difficult to get to them as they will be in the back (behind the tanks). If you rush in you are sure to die unless you get a really sneaky q in (also a ward in lane can do wonders as I have used that to do very sneaky stuff in the past XD) but once again it is still up to a good bit of luck or bad coordination from the other team. The main thing that this helped me recognize is I need to branch out my mains... I have a strong ali, mundo, malphite, and amumu. The problem is ali/malphite are banned a lot and amumu can be counter-jungled hard by mundo(or by pretty much any junlger) so it didn't seem like a good idea to choose him(outside of my warding we really didn't have much coverage of the map or our jungle). All in all I need to buy a few more jungles to help with the afore mentioned issues. I am looking to buy maoki, skarner, and maybe xin(with his latest buff) as soon as I get the ip for them(I hate spending 6300 on a champ:(). I figured I should share some of my knowledge and what I learned from this as it may be nice for other people to know. Also as for RoG's teir lists I really don't follow them all that much as they are simply based on tournament choices. Just b/c they are tier one doesn't mean they are good for all cases. One thing I will point out is not to long ago nocturne was a teir 2-3 on one of those lists lol and now with his ult and passive nerf(the passive hit his sustain rather badly) he is T1... hmmmmmm just kinda makes you wonder were they come up with their numbers.[/quote]

[quote=BarbJ]Between Olaf and Nocturne, Nocturne is a better ganker. The fear (hard CC), though inconsistent, is better than an inconsistent slow. Nocturne's ability to turn an unfavorable situation into an even one or perhaps even turning it in your favor is something you need to consider when thinking of his strength. I'm sure you'd agree that Nocturne offers a lot when it comes to early and mid game skirmishes of 2v1 in top or mid, or 3v2 in bot. If you're looking for someone else tanky with initiation, I would suggest Jarvan. His CC is reliable (not tethered, AoE slow, knock-up CC). He also gives aura AS and armor. Amumu can actually do well against Mundo in the early phases of the game. Since Mundo needs to sacrifice health to jungle, and Amumu has the damage reduction from E (however little it may be), if you catch a Mundo you can kill it pretty easy. Amumu is very strong, there is no reason to avoid picking him. Lee Sin has an attack speed slow like Malphite's, so the thought process behind "even a weak Malphite can shred AS" I feel applies to Lee Sin. While Lee Sin is less inately tanky than Malphite, the chasing potential he gives you by being able to jump over walls to kill those who are running (combined with the fact that this is an execute spell) I feel makes up for his "falling off." The jungle tier list is not based on tournament choices alone, though that is a factor. Much like everyone's pick I would assume: "This guy did well in that tournament game agaisnt this team, should do well here." Though that is a factor, it doesn't decide everything. The ratings of the junglers isn't based on just stats (passive stats, nerf or buff numbers), it's all relative. If the meta changes, the list changes. If one guy becomes popular from a buff, someone who is strong against him gets "revisited" and people realize how strong they are again. If the typical builds change, other junglers will become stronger. I don't know specifically what made Nocturne move up, but something happened that made him a better choice now than he was. The list may not be perfect, but you can trust it to tell you that guys in Tier 1 are better than guys in Tier 2.[/quote]

[quote=Arkharan]The tier lists are only there to give you a good idea of who is good atm and who is not. I'd suggest you make your own decision on who is good (strong initiate, fast clear, good ganks) and who are bad. For exemple Lee Sin, a lot of people likes him, including me. A lot doesn't because late game he falls off a lot. What I do to make my own choices: #1 Am-I good with this champion? (One of the most important factor I tend to practice the champions I'm not good with in blind normals) #2 Is this champion usefull for my team / or is it only a fun champion (Good cc / initiate / clear time / late game) #3 What kind of champion is this champion? (Passive (farm for late game), Agressive constant ganks) A good exemple of this would be Shyvana and Alistar[/quote]

[quote=ShoreXShot]Nocturne has been nerfed since release so there hasn't been anything to increase his presence in the jungle except tournament play... this also happend with Dr. Mundo who only tell rather recently was considered a bad Shyvana or Teir 2/3 jungler. This is something that the writer has admitted in the past. The choices are primarily based on professional play and while being in tier one means you have a stronger potential it doesn't mean anything without the team being behind them. If you watch Azingy play (A ~2400 elo jungle) you will see alot of other jungles used(well into tier 3 and 4) and notice that tier list get destroyed in ways you wouldn't believe. The jungler has to fall into the team comp(something I am still working on). This I think is what really changes things as it is very hard to get the appropriate jungler if your team doesn't work with you. This is why it is often necessary to take a jungler with a strong initiate due to the number of jungles that can do such as opposed to the mids(can think of very few mostly involving a hourglass),tops(there are a couple but not near as many as jungle), and bots(absolute suicide in most cases). This of course is due to the current meta but as things are, I am seeing a trend more in the direction of tanky CC jungles. This frees up your other lanes to focus on handling the damage aspect which to a point is best as they are going to ideally have more money to spend. These and anything I say are my opinions (in no way facts), that are continually evolving as time goes on, as I am far from an expert and always striving to learn more. I think I just found my new signature ^ lol. Edit: I really need to refresh my page so I don't reiterate someone who posts before me lol[/quote]