Idea for ashe

[quote=DuffTime]1% extra chance to crit on slowed target per level 8D[/quote]

[quote=example1013][quote=Klausenheim] That wouldn't be nearly enough to bring her up to Graves / Kog / Cait / Vayne territory. If you changed it to scale, maybe, just maybe. But that is exactly what Jeffy and I mentioned a few pages ago. A flat 3 AD increase that wouldn't even apply all the time (only to targets afflicted by frost shot) is just too small imo. [/quote] You're completely missing the point. Ashe is already a good late-game champ because she does carry-level late-game damage just with right-clicks, combined with a utility kit that facerapes the enemy team. Her problem is her terrible early game, which just isn't strong enough for her to regularly make it out of laning phase and still carry even in a good game. Giving her a scaling steroid does nothing to help her early, and just makes her late game even stronger, which leaves her about where she is now in terms of viability. Giving her a flat steroid that's situationally strong early (useful in trades, provided she has the resources) but that falls off late gives her the strength to trade with the enemy team and regularly survive laning so she can reach her scary late-game potential. 3 AD may be too low, but it would have to be somewhere between like 3 and 10. Enough so that she doesn't outdps enemy carries early, but can still be enough of a threat in trades to make the enemy wary of a fight.[/quote]

[quote=Mooninites]I was actually thinking that changing her passive would be very beneficial to her. Something like 'Wild Quiver' in which she has a chance each auto attack to instantly fire another auto attack dealing 25% or 33% of her auto attack damage. I know Riot hates RNG, but her passive crit is only strong at level 1, and only active while waiting for fights or running from the health platform to a lane.[/quote]

[quote=Temzilla][quote=example1013] You're completely missing the point. Ashe is already a good late-game champ because she does carry-level late-game damage just with right-clicks, combined with a utility kit that facerapes the enemy team. Her problem is her terrible early game, which just isn't strong enough for her to regularly make it out of laning phase and still carry even in a good game.[/quote] AHAHAHA. Her early game is strong, her late game is a peice of poop because she has no steroids. Everything you said in that paragraph is 100% backwards.[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime][quote=example1013] You're completely missing the point. Ashe is already a good late-game champ because she does carry-level late-game damage just with right-clicks, combined with a utility kit that facerapes the enemy team. Her problem is her terrible early game, which just isn't strong enough for her to regularly make it out of laning phase and still carry even in a good game. Giving her a scaling steroid does nothing to help her early, and just makes her late game even stronger, which leaves her about where she is now in terms of viability. Giving her a flat steroid that's situationally strong early (useful in trades, provided she has the resources) but that falls off late gives her the strength to trade with the enemy team and regularly survive laning so she can reach her scary late-game potential. 3 AD may be too low, but it would have to be somewhere between like 3 and 10. Enough so that she doesn't outdps enemy carries early, but can still be enough of a threat in trades to make the enemy wary of a fight. [/quote] Her end game damage is shit compare to other carry types. And, not to mention, zero escapes and whatnot. She's pretty trashbag as far as carry champs go.[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime][quote=Mooninites] I was actually thinking that changing her passive would be very beneficial to her. Something like 'Wild Quiver' in which she has a chance each auto attack to instantly fire another auto attack dealing 25% or 33% of her auto attack damage. I know Riot hates RNG, but her passive crit is only strong at level 1, and only active while waiting for fights or running from the health platform to a lane. [/quote] kinda kewl ye, I dig it.[/quote]

[quote=Klausenheim][quote=Mooninites] I was actually thinking that changing her passive would be very beneficial to her. Something like 'Wild Quiver' in which she has a chance each auto attack to instantly fire another auto attack dealing 25% or 33% of her auto attack damage. I know Riot hates RNG, but her passive crit is only strong at level 1, and only active while waiting for fights or running from the health platform to a lane. [/quote] + Rep for a cool idea with a name to match. Overall I think there are a lot of places you could "insert" a tweak into Ashe's kit. I like the passive change a lot, I also like the idea of adding in additional benefits to her Q or E. Really I don't care where it goes. The real point is, IF she is going to regain top-carry status (and by that I mean in the top group, not a "clear #1 op huehuehue), she needs a damage steroid.[/quote]

[quote=Klausenheim][quote=example1013] You're completely missing the point. Ashe is already a good late-game champ because she does carry-level late-game damage just with right-clicks, combined with a utility kit that facerapes the enemy team. [/quote] I still disagree. Yes, Ashe can be useful late game - but *solely* because her perma slow punishes any enemies who move out of position and her ultimate is a fantastic initiation tool. She does the same right click damage as any other champion who builds full AD Damage. In that respect she is probably a worse carry than Annie - at least Annie has a higher ranged auto attack and a stun that isn't on a ultimate-level cooldown. There is literally no mathematical way Ashe can do the same amount of damage as a Vayne / Caitlynn / Kog / Graves. And again, please don't think I'm trying to trash your opinion - I *love* Ashe, she is my go-to ranged character. I have, and will continue to, play her regardless of whether or not she gets buffed. This thread just happened to come up with some really good ideas, and I came here to lend them my support as well as voice some ideas of my own.[/quote]

[quote=Babit]When teamfights start, it's nearly impossible to not get instagibd as ashe. I rarely play ashe anymore, but any time I see one in que I immediately pick irelia and literally drop ashe in 2 seconds on my own in every fight. She needs SOMETHING to avoid this. So I immediately look at the only other champion without a low cd escape. Sivir. Sivir got reworked into a kiting machine. Better than ashe even. Why is this? Spell shield is a serious part of it, but I couldn't see that getting worked into ashes kit. BUT sivirs passive is the real threat. So, maybe something along the lines of when ashe frosts a target (Q, volley, or ulti) she gains movement speed. I wouldn't know good numbers for it, but I'm sure riot could come up with a balanced number. The passive could also get a rework. Idc what they do, but anything is better than what it is now. Pretty sure they came up with that before they realized everyone would afk farm in this game for the first 20 mins.[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime][quote=Babit] She needs SOMETHING to avoid this. [/quote] She needs full tanky utility support items! And gold per ten runes :)[/quote]