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Upcoming Ahri nerf in Draven's patch

Creator: Blood26 June 1, 2012 12:46pm
Blood26
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People, I still need to say this.
LATE GAME BUFF OR NOT, THE NERF WILL HAMPER AHRI'S ABILITY TO DO WELL LATE GAME.

I AM SURE SOME OF US HERE AGREE WITH MY POINT OF VIEW.

GOOD EARLY GAME DETERMINES GOOD LATE GAME AND VICE VERSA.

THAT INCREASED AP RATIO IS ******** !
0.5 WON'T EVEN HELP YOU UNTIL YOU HAVE 400 AP (WHICH IS A DEATHCAP AND A RYLAI MINIMUM), WHICH SPIRIT RUSH BENEFITS FROM. BUT FF WILL NOT DO **** UNTIL YOU HAVE 800 AP LATE GAME.

800 AP IS VERY VERY RARE, UNLESS YOU PLAN TO STACK ITEMS.

Ahri is very very early game dependent, people, Ahri will not have a good late game if her early game sucks. UNDERSTAND THAT ! And stop saying we're crying about Ahri getting "nerf" instead of a late game buff in disguise.

You will not enjoy that privilege so long as Ahri sucks early game.

Game phase is one of Ahri's most important aspects of gameplay, you nerf that, you nerf the whole thing.
THANK YOU LACORPSE FOR THE SIGGY. YOU HAVE SUCH A GOOD FAN SERVICE :D !!

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This honestly makes her less of a faceroll champ and is a buff for me. My main mid is ahri and I will take like changd thankfully. Now the opponent doesn't insta die from getting hit by a charm, it just takes a bit more skill and harass before going for a kill. Good job on riots part ...

To those complaining, you haven't played ahri enough, and you rely on bad players to get you fedd so you still dominate late game. That's not reality, ahris ratios were horrible and this buff is great.
yolo, teemo to strong in low elo
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You incorrectly assume it's some sort of huge nerf from day one, proposing the question "how many of you are against the nerf ?", which further implies all you want people to do is agree to your point of view that it is a nerf so much that you state it as fact. You've even said "finally" to a post that agreed with you - which draws me to believe you don't want to believe it's a buff, nor discuss it or why it may actually be good for the game.


Anyway, enough with the Freudian slips, on to my thoughts (assuming you'll listen) -

Was this a nerf? Yes. Was it a big nerf that means she's now underpowered and terrible? Definitely not.

Most Ahri players take one point in Fox Fire and max it second. Its rank one damage stays exactly the same, hence it does not hurt her before level 8.

Spirit Rush was a tone down to her already dominant early game - her ult gives too much mobility AND damage, not a mix betwee the two.

Late game, Ahri is going to be ALMOST the same. Slightly worse, I agree - but she'll still be picked competitively. She needed a toning down as she was too dominant EARLY game but as you say she's hard to play late game, which stays almost the same.

TL;DR
Ahri was too strong early game
Post-6 (but pre-late game) nerfed, pre-6 unchanged
Ahri's late game unchanged - despite what Riot seemed to want to make out
Ahri will remain a competitive and strong pick, just slightly less overpowering early game to face, as anybody that encounters her

Regarding this -
"Do you see Brand having to go in up close and kill other champions ? No.
Does Lux do that ? No.
Does LB do that ? Noooo."

The difference is that Ahri is picked competitively and those champions aren't - with all three of them considered underpowered and in need of a buff (except maybe Brand depending who you ask). Extremely bad example.

Also - doesn't matter how comparatively high Ahri's skill ceiling is - no champion in LoL requires a mastermind to play to their full potential or is properly hard. Somebody will master them in a few games, undoubtedly, and that shouldn't mean they can dominate everything because they're good at a hero - though obviously it means they should be better than, say, Garen who presses E and wins (and as you can see, this is the case, Garen is usually seen as terrible). To be properly hard they need to remain hard to the masters of that champion (as a good example though one you may be unfamiliar with, Invoker from DotA has 10 abilities he has to get one by one, thereby choosing to the situation each time, and of course remembering them - Dendi, one of the more well known Invoker players - is still never absolutely flawless, whereas watching Bigfatjiji play Ahri or whatever is not the same).


She still remains a good pick. It doesn't matter if they buff everyone else (who may indeed require a buff), if a champion is too strong a champion is too strong. Thankfully they only nerfed a small portion of her early game.
Blood26
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Mikuroo wrote:

This honestly makes her less of a faceroll champ and is a buff for me. My main mid is ahri and I will take like changd thankfully. Now the opponent doesn't insta die from getting hit by a charm, it just takes a bit more skill and harass before going for a kill. Good job on riots part ...

To those complaining, you haven't played ahri enough, and you rely on bad players to get you fedd so you still dominate late game. That's not reality, ahris ratios were horrible and this buff is great.


Ahri's ratio had always been bad, but the buff isn't gonna help her.
Ahri doesn't kill when she lands her charms, Ahri's playstyle had always been kiting and harassing before taking calculated risk and going in for the kill.

Your post makes no sense.

Ahri players who do well late game shows more than being fed by bad players, that is your personal opinion.
Late game is all about teamwork and ganking.
Bear in mind that you need to consider these factors during late game.
Ahri can be barely fed because everyone goes in team by then.
And she can't take down squishy targets outside of team clashes or ganks because squishies are always protected by their team.

Your main mid is Ahri ? Well my main is Ahri.
And I know for one that Ahri's current playstyle is to harass and move in for a secured kill.
The post nerf will hamper her ability to do that.
Your point makes no complete sense at all.
THANK YOU LACORPSE FOR THE SIGGY. YOU HAVE SUCH A GOOD FAN SERVICE :D !!

I have a request to all of the users on Mobafire. If it's not too much for you guys, do +Rep me if I've said something reasonable, crack a funny joke or provide the latest updates . Likewise, I've been +Rep-ing people so long as I find their post likeable. So let's help out each other now, shall we ;) ?
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Xenasis wrote:

You incorrectly assume it's some sort of huge nerf from day one, proposing the question "how many of you are against the nerf ?", which further implies all you want people to do is agree to your point of view that it is a nerf so much that you state it as fact. You've even said "finally" to a post that agreed with you - which draws me to believe you don't want to believe it's a buff, nor discuss it or why it may actually be good for the game.


Anyway, enough with the Freudian slips, on to my thoughts (assuming you'll listen) -

Was this a nerf? Yes. Was it a big nerf that means she's now underpowered and terrible? Definitely not.

Most Ahri players take one point in Fox Fire and max it second. Its rank one damage stays exactly the same, hence it does not hurt her before level 8.

Spirit Rush was a tone down to her already dominant early game - her ult gives too much mobility AND damage, not a mix betwee the two.

Late game, Ahri is going to be ALMOST the same. Slightly worse, I agree - but she'll still be picked competitively. She needed a toning down as she was too dominant EARLY game but as you say she's hard to play late game, which stays almost the same.

TL;DR
Ahri was too strong early game
Post-6 (but pre-late game) nerfed, pre-6 unchanged
Ahri's late game unchanged - despite what Riot seemed to want to make out
Ahri will remain a competitive and strong pick, just slightly less overpowering early game to face, as anybody that encounters her

Regarding this -
"Do you see Brand having to go in up close and kill other champions ? No.
Does Lux do that ? No.
Does LB do that ? Noooo."

The difference is that Ahri is picked competitively and those champions aren't - with all three of them considered underpowered and in need of a buff (except maybe Brand depending who you ask). Extremely bad example.

Also - doesn't matter how comparatively high Ahri's skill ceiling is - no champion in LoL requires a mastermind to play to their full potential or is properly hard. Somebody will master them in a few games, undoubtedly, and that shouldn't mean they can dominate everything because they're good at a hero - though obviously it means they should be better than, say, Garen who presses E and wins (and as you can see, this is the case, Garen is usually seen as terrible). To be properly hard they need to remain hard to the masters of that champion (as a good example though one you may be unfamiliar with, Invoker from DotA has 10 abilities he has to get one by one, thereby choosing to the situation each time, and of course remembering them - Dendi, one of the more well known Invoker players - is still never absolutely flawless, whereas watching Bigfatjiji play Ahri or whatever is not the same).


She still remains a good pick. It doesn't matter if they buff everyone else (who may indeed require a buff), if a champion is too strong a champion is too strong. Thankfully they only nerfed a small portion of her early game.


Psychoanalyzing me ?
I am just glad some agrees with me is willing to say it out without having the fear of being flamed.

Competitive or not, there are many people who plays pub out of ranked games. Your statement only shows that you are thinking from a competitive point of view. But what about pub players who pick any of those "underpicked" champions ?

Most players, but not all players max Fire Fox second.
Strong early game or not, I stand by my point of view.
Think about it, if Ahri didn't have a strong early game, do you think she'd have a good late game ?

How is that possible ? Ahri needs to kill early game to do well late game.
She can't be farming all the time, by then the enemy team would have pushed down 2 or 3 turrets when she gets them.
The thing is, everyone is contradicting their own statements by saying Ahri is going to have a weak early game, but she is still "good" etc etc.

Any Ahri players would know early game marks her transition in to a good late game.
Very simple, you say her late game gets buffed.

But what if she does badly early game ? Do you think she'll be enjoying the privileges of the late game buff ?
No.

Picked competitively ? We shall see. When Ahri gets nerfed right in the face, all of us Ahri players are going to feel it. Like it or not, that buff will not help us.

0.5 increase in ratios, that only helps when you've achieved a certain amount of AP.
Even before this, I consider Ahri to be slightly underpowered ever since Hecarim's Patch was announced.
Many heroes were buffed, but Ahri remained the same.
It hampered her ability to do well.
It's fine that Ahri gets no buff, but it hurts when Ahri gets nerfed. Especially when she's fine as she is now.

The main point of going against the nerf is this.

"Early game dictates late game"
You take away Ahri's early game, she won't have a good late game.
Even with the ratios buffed, or with enormous amount of AP granted to her.
Ahri is a very game phase dependent champion.
I'm sure we all know that.
It IS her core.

Regarding her ULT, Ahri is only mobile when her ult is available.
That is all I will say, without her ult, Ahri becomes a walking food like any other squishies.
The nerf to her ult was unnecessary, especially not the cooldown in between each second.
THANK YOU LACORPSE FOR THE SIGGY. YOU HAVE SUCH A GOOD FAN SERVICE :D !!

I have a request to all of the users on Mobafire. If it's not too much for you guys, do +Rep me if I've said something reasonable, crack a funny joke or provide the latest updates . Likewise, I've been +Rep-ing people so long as I find their post likeable. So let's help out each other now, shall we ;) ?
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As a Lux player, I wouldn't mind the nerf :P
This will make mid lane easier >:D
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All I really care about is that she'll have less base damage during lane phase.
Take that for what you will.

@Blood26 please try not to make multiple posts in a row, you can always go back and edit your previous post.
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MissWitch wrote:

As a Lux player, I wouldn't mind the nerf :P
This will make mid lane easier >:D


Lux > Ahri ._.

Or atleast for me, but Lux goes OOM so easily.
THANK YOU LACORPSE FOR THE SIGGY. YOU HAVE SUCH A GOOD FAN SERVICE :D !!

I have a request to all of the users on Mobafire. If it's not too much for you guys, do +Rep me if I've said something reasonable, crack a funny joke or provide the latest updates . Likewise, I've been +Rep-ing people so long as I find their post likeable. So let's help out each other now, shall we ;) ?
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Blood26 wrote:

Psychoanalyzing me ?
I am just glad some agrees with me is willing to say it out without having the fear of being flamed.

Competitive or not, there are many people who plays pub out of ranked games. Your statement only shows that you are thinking from a competitive point of view. But what about pub players who pick any of those "underpicked" champions ?

Most players, but not all players max Fire Fox second.
Strong early game or not, I stand by my point of view.
Think about it, if Ahri didn't have a strong early game, do you think she'd have a good late game ?

How is that possible ? Ahri needs to kill early game to do well late game.
She can't be farming all the time, by then the enemy team would have pushed down 2 or 3 turrets when she gets them.
The thing is, everyone is contradicting their own statements by saying Ahri is going to have a weak early game, but she is still "good" etc etc.

Any Ahri players would know early game marks her transition in to a good late game.
Very simple, you say her late game gets buffed.

But what if she does badly early game ? Do you think she'll be enjoying the privileges of the late game buff ?
No.

Picked competitively ? We shall see. When Ahri gets nerfed right in the face, all of us Ahri players are going to feel it. Like it or not, that buff will not help us.

0.5 increase in ratios, that only helps when you've achieved a certain amount of AP.
Even before this, I consider Ahri to be slightly underpowered ever since Hecarim's Patch was announced.
Many heroes were buffed, but Ahri remained the same.
It hampered her ability to do well.
It's fine that Ahri gets no buff, but it hurts when Ahri gets nerfed. Especially when she's fine as she is now.

The main point of going against the nerf is this.

"Early game dictates late game"
You take away Ahri's early game, she won't have a good late game.
Even with the ratios buffed, or with enormous amount of AP granted to her.
Ahri is a very game phase dependent champion.
I'm sure we all know that.
It IS her core.

Regarding her ULT, Ahri is only mobile when her ult is available.
That is all I will say, without her ult, Ahri becomes a walking food like any other squishies.
The nerf to her ult was unnecessary, especially not the cooldown in between each second.


Heh, psychoanalysis would require me to put you under hypnosis and such, no - that was merely analysing one or two slips.

I'm not just thinking about competitive games - she's a force to be reckoned with in normal and ranked games by decent players, too. It wouldn't be right to say "Oh, well it's all right for X champion to be too strong elsewhere if they aren't good in lower Elo games".

Exactly, people max Fox Fire second. Be glad they didn't nerf Orb of Deception. The nerf to Fox Fire instead meant that actually an extremely minor nerf.

"How is that possible ? Ahri needs to kill early game to do well late game.
She can't be farming all the time, by then the enemy team would have pushed down 2 or 3 turrets when she gets them.
The thing is, everyone is contradicting their own statements by saying Ahri is going to have a weak early game, but she is still "good" etc etc."
You should watch Bigfatjiji's Ahri. His playstyle is known to be passivity 101, and indeed that's what he does, essentially proving that 'need' for kills early game wrong. Ahri can farm extremely well, someone who can't, hence needs early game kills, is LeBlanc.

"But what if she does badly early game ? Do you think she'll be enjoying the privileges of the late game buff ?
No."
If you do badly in the early game you should do worse in the late game like every champion should. Ahri has an exceptional late game due to her ult though.

"Picked competitively ? We shall see. When Ahri gets nerfed right in the face, all of us Ahri players are going to feel it. Like it or not, that buff will not help us."
It's an extremely small nerf and she was already a great pick competitively.

"Even before this, I consider Ahri to be slightly underpowered ever since Hecarim's Patch was announced."
Definitely a biased viewpoint. Ahri is always picked competitively and isn't exactly rare to see. She was not perfectly balanced as it was, she was slightly (hence the tiny nerf) too strong if anything.

"You take away Ahri's early game, she won't have a good late game."
They're not, though. Again you instantly assume Ahri is now terrible early game from 5-10 damage missing from her secondary skill. Her main skill remains the same and her early ranks of Fox Fire aren't much different, with the first being exactly the same. It's 5-10 damage, that does NOT now mean she has the worst early game in the world. It will remain dominant and almost as good as it was before.

"Regarding her ULT, Ahri is only mobile when her ult is available."
Of course, but it has damage AND mobility. Many squishy carries' ults only have damage. Also, you'll always have your ult in a team fight, you won't squander its use on minions or something silly.

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