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Luther3000 wrote:
Basically the choice you're making is this.
Do you want: Siphoning Strike with 4 cooldown, 110 flat damage, and potentially a bunch more damage from last hits whilst Spirit Fire having 12 cooldown, 55 damage + 11 per second, plus 20 armour reduction.
Or: Siphoning Strike with 8 second cooldown, 30 flat damage, probably noticably less damage from last hits, whilst having Spirit Fire with the same cooldown, 215 damage + 43 per second, plus 40 armour reduction.
Actually looking at those numbers it's closer than I initially thought, but we all agree that Spirit Fire is largely useless for the damage part. Bearing in mind that people will just walk out of Spirit Fire right away, I think it's still better to go for half cooldowns in Nasus' BEST, MOST DAMAGING skill, the one that makes him so powerful if you can farm it (much easier with half cooldown). You still get 20 armour reduction on his Spirit Fire too. Imo SF is not worth it just for the extra 20 reduction compared to the benefits of SS.
Also as Nighthawk said the armour reduction won't even help at all if your AD carry isn't taking advantage of it.
If your team is terrible, nasus was a bad pick.
Basically, Spirit Fire does better damage, is AoE, and it makes your damage output more balanced and forces your lane enemy to build both resists, and lots of them, or deal with your true damage.
Tri lane for life.
Temzilla wrote:
Basically, Spirit Fire does better damage
I really can't tell you how much I disagree. Have you even seen a Nasus with his Q farmed before? Granted I haven't played him since the buff, but there's no way that dealing half its damage up front has made it that good.
IMO Spirit Fire was one of the worst skills in the game pre-buff, and it's probably still not great. Siphoning Strike on the other hand, is great. Also, Spirit Fire PUSHES YOUR LANE, and takes away last hits from your Q if you use it in the laning phase.
In my mind this is kind of like how everyone maxes out Q first on Xin Zhao; it makes absolutely no sense to do it, but everyone does it anyway.
Luther3000 wrote:
I really can't tell you how much I disagree. Have you even seen a Nasus with his Q farmed before?
Granted I haven't played him since the buff, but there's no way that dealing half its damage up front has made it that good.
IMO Spirit Fire was one of the worst skills in the game pre-buff, and it's probably still not great. Siphoning Strike on the other hand, is great. Also, Spirit Fire PUSHES YOUR LANE, and takes away last hits from your Q if you use it in the laning phase.
In my mind this is kind of like how everyone maxes out Q first on Xin Zhao; it makes absolutely no sense to do it, but everyone does it anyway.
Spirit Fire does some damage, but the main point is the 40 armor reduction at rank 5.
With runes, you will do true damage until people buy heavy amounts of resist items.
You also need to build Magic Resist because of the damage from spirit fire.
Spirit Fire into Wither into Q spam, and then maybe ult if you need to is pretty good damage, and can kill most lane enemies.
I don't really play nasus, but i've laned against a LOT of nasus before.
All the ones i really had trouble beating in lane maxed spirit fire first.
Tri lane for life.
You don't need to build ****, just walk out of it's pathetic damage and pummel the **** out of him while he's stuck with 8 second cooldown, no damage Q.
And you still get half of the armour reduction anyway.
And you still get half of the armour reduction anyway.
Luther3000 wrote:
You don't need to build ****, just walk out of it's pathetic damage and pummel the **** out of him while he's stuck with 8 second cooldown, no damage Q.
And you still get half of the armour reduction anyway.
When he puts Spirit fire on top of you, and then withers you, even with Merc Treads, you are forced to run and take massive harass and be forced to B, OR you are forced to duel him and probably eat a few ticks of spirit fire.
Tri lane for life.
I think once again neither of us will win this argument. :P
Always fun sparring with you though, good sir.
Always fun sparring with you though, good sir.
Luther3000 wrote:
I think once again neither of us will win this argument. :P
Always fun sparring with you though, good sir.
I'm just trying to say Q isn't the end all answer to everything :s.
Nasus can either lane passively, or he can be aggressive and destroy you.
I once said something about Nasus, "Nasus is probably the only character in the game that Mordekaiser can 1v1 at level 1 and win the fight" because i felt nasus was extremely weak in the early game.
After the buffs, Nasus is a tough lane if he's playing aggressive.
Tri lane for life.
It was a compliment. I guess I should try him again next time he's free, and maybe try skilling E first. I reaaaally don't think it'll be as good though.
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Imagine how much more damage your team would do in an early mid teamfight if you have Spirit Fire first. Your personal damage < The team's total damage.
Basically the choice you're making is this.
Do you want: Siphoning Strike with 4 cooldown, 110 flat damage, and potentially a bunch more damage from last hits whilst Spirit Fire having 12 cooldown, 55 damage + 11 per second, plus 20 armour reduction.
Or: Siphoning Strike with 8 second cooldown, 30 flat damage, probably noticably less damage from last hits, whilst having Spirit Fire with the same cooldown, 215 damage + 43 per second, plus 40 armour reduction.
Actually looking at those numbers it's closer than I initially thought, but we all agree that Spirit Fire is largely useless for the damage part. Bearing in mind that people will just walk out of Spirit Fire right away, I think it's still better to go for half cooldowns in Nasus' BEST, MOST DAMAGING skill, the one that makes him so powerful if you can farm it (much easier with half cooldown). You still get 20 armour reduction on his Spirit Fire too. Imo SF is not worth it just for the extra 20 reduction compared to the benefits of SS. It's much easier to miss Spirit Fire or only hit one or two people with it than you'd think, too, and SS never misses.
Also as Nighthawk said the armour reduction won't even help at all if your AD carry isn't taking advantage of it.
As far as I'm concerned Nasus' basic purpose in the game is to AFK farm top lane for 30 minutes or so and then start two shotting squishies with his Q while also being tanky. It'll have a lot more damage from last hits if you maxed it first.