MrPen boots not really worth it (with a graph)

[quote=Traa1703][img]http://ia600605.us.archive.org/9/items/MrpenBootsEffektivitet/MrpenBootsEffektivitet.png[/img] All graphs have 9 MrPen from runes Red: Base spell damage (260 dmg, 9 MrPen) Light blue: With MrPen boots (260 dmg, 29 MrPen) Green: With Cdr boots (260 dmg, 15% Cdr 9 MrPen) Dark blue: With Haunting Guise and Cdr boots (280 dmg, 15% Cdr, 29 MrPen) 20 extra dmg from Haunting Guise's AP Purple: With Haunting Guise and MrPen boots (280 dmg, 29 MrPen) 20 extra dmg from Haunting Guise's AP. At 62 Mr the effectiveness of Cdr boots surpass the effectiveness MrPen boots. At 82 with [[Haunting Guise]]. This shows that unless the enemy buys zero magic resist items, MrPen boots is a highly situational item which will only increase your damage against the squishiest of the squishies unless followed up by [[Haunting Guise]]. I have compared them to [[Ionian boots of lucidity]], which are cheaper, to show how quickly 20 MrPen extra starts to lose it's effectiveness. The graphs intersect at 62 and 82 Mr. The graphs also show how big of an upgrade [[Haunting Guise]] is (about the same as [[Needlessly Large Rod]], however the worse the Ap ratios are the better off an option [[Haunting Guise]] will be. Thus [[Haunting Guise]] will stay really effective until the [[Negatron Cloak]]s are bought but even then you may have taken advantage off the early edge given by [[Haunting Guise]] to put your team in the lead. Edit: For Cdr I multiplied the function with 1,15 which, as Searz pointed out, only works for spells with short cooldowns, like [[Transfusion]]. For spells with longer cooldowns you would be considering buying Cdr for entirely different reazons then short cooldown spells. Thus these graphs shows how the items influence a spell's DPS.[/quote]

[quote=The_Nameless_Bard]Hmmm what about if you get a abyssal scepter (AKA 60 flat MrPen effectively)?[/quote]

[quote=Crazy Smurf]Now i can boast in with my 14 Runes Magic Pen. + MPR Boots. With Guise you get 54 MPen, enough to pierce through everyone who are not tanky, hate when people think that 5 points of Pen. won't do any difference and then cry because someone survived with 10 HP :/[/quote]

[quote=The_Nameless_Bard][quote=Crazy Smurf] Now i can boast in with my 14 Runes Magic Pen. + MPR Boots. With Guise you get 54 MPen, enough to pierce through everyone who are not tanky, hate when people think that 5 points of Pen. won't do any difference and then cry because someone survived with 10 HP :/ [/quote] ikr?[/quote]

[quote=Traa1703][quote=The_Nameless_Bard] Hmmm what about if you get a abyssal scepter (AKA 60 flat MrPen effectively)? [/quote] When you have bought [[Abyssal Scepter]], MrPen boots and [[Haunting Guise]], even the carries will have defensive items like [[Banshees Veil]]. Versus such items [[Void Staff]] is always a better option for MrPen.[/quote]

[quote=Searz]While I applaud the fact that you're using graphs to illustrate your point, you don't explain everything. You're basically increasing the damage per second (Y) by 15% with the CDR, right? You need to make it clear that you aren't comparing damage, but in fact; DPS. Lots of AP champions are constructed around NUKING and MrP helps with that while CDR doesn't. So if MrP boots can compare with the CDR boots in DPS, I consider them very worthwhile.[/quote]

[quote=Temzilla]Most carries carry only one defensive item. [icon=Banshee's Veil size=64] That means that if something is better until 82 MR, a Carry won't have 82 MR, they will have 80. Also, this is fundamentally flawed, because there is an abundance of CDR on items, where as there is no way to increase Damage directly from boots other than Sorcerer's Shoes. [quote=Searz] While I applaud the fact that you're using graphs to illustrate your point, you don't explain everything. You're basically increasing the damage per second (Y) by 15% with the CDR, right? You need to make it clear that you aren't comparing damage, but in fact; DPS. Lots of AP champions are constructed around NUKING and MrP helps with that while CDR doesn't. So if MrP boots can compare with the CDR boots in DPS, I consider them very worthwhile. [/quote] No, CDR isn't linear. 15% CDR is a 17% DPS increase, just as 40% CDR is a 66.666% dps increase. 100% CDR is an infinite damage increase after all. [quote=The_Nameless_Bard] Hmmm what about if you get a abyssal scepter (AKA 60 flat MrPen effectively)? [/quote] Graph moves over by 20.[/quote]

[quote=Traa1703]@Temzilla How would I calculate proper DPS increase from Cdr?[/quote]

[quote=Searz][quote=Temzilla] No, CDR isn't linear. 15% CDR is a 17% DPS increase, just as 40% CDR is a 66.666% dps increase. 100% CDR is an infinite damage increase after all.[/quote] I'm unfamiliar with how it works. Care to explain? Traa seems to want to know too.[/quote]

[quote=Temzilla][quote=Searz] [quote=Temzilla] No, CDR isn't linear. 15% CDR is a 17% DPS increase, just as 40% CDR is a 66.666% dps increase. 100% CDR is an infinite damage increase after all.[/quote] I'm unfamiliar with how it works. Care to explain? Traa seems to want to know too. [/quote] Lets look at say Trueshot Barrage, 100s CD, makes the math simple. With 1% CDR you have a 99s CD. If Trueshot does 1000 damage, that means that you are doing (1000/99) = 10.101 dps, up from (1000/10)=10 dps. That is a (10.10101/10)=1.01% increase. Now lets use a more significant example. 100s No CDR, 1000 Damage, 10dps. 60s 40s CDR, 1000 Damage, 16.666dps That's a (16.666/10) 66.66% increase. [quote=Traa1703] @Temzilla How would I calculate proper DPS increase from Cdr? [/quote] Total Damage/ ( Cooldown * 1-CDR ) basically.[/quote]