Ninja Tabi stand better on itself now? Buffed...

[quote=Luther3000]I don't understand what you're trying to say.[/quote]

[quote=caucheka]also dodge doesnt factor in crits. the chance of an attack being a crit is calculated after calculating chance to hit. therefore dodge has no effect on the number of times you get critted. (it just pretends those attacks never happened) the 10% reduction does factor in crits.[/quote]

[quote=Temzilla][quote=caucheka] also dodge doesnt factor in crits. the chance of an attack being a crit is calculated after calculating chance to hit. therefore dodge has no effect on the number of times you get critted. (it just pretends those attacks never happened) the 10% reduction does factor in crits. [/quote] Double roll system is the same as the single roll system over a large number of attacks. 10% DR is equal to 10% dodge. Dodge is spiky, DR is not, that is the ONLY difference. In an extremely high level of play, consistency is always better than random number generation. Tournament play is not about potential, it is about expected value. DR > Dodge because of that.[/quote]

[quote=lifebaka]Okay, let's look at expected value. Statistics time! Let's pick some whole number of attacks n (greater than zero) to look at. Then we sum [indent](dodge chance)^x * (1 - dodge chance)^(n - x) * n!/(x!*(n-x)!) * x/n[/indent] for integer values of x from 0 to n. The first part is the likelihood of dodging x attacks, the second part is the likelihood of not dodging the rest of the attacks, the third part is the number of ways that a particular number of dodges and non-dodges can happen, and fourth is the damage mitigation related to dodging that many times. If you run the above (which I already have done [url=https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AkzF06wI4oFgdFd6QVhLOWstTEJYdHBjNUl3cFR6Nmc]here[/url] for n = 10), you'll find that the sum always comes out to [i]exactly[/i] your dodge chance, for all values of n. As in, no matter how many attacks we look at, the expected damage mitigation per attack is exactly your dodge chance. So, statistically, the expected values dodge and damage reduction are identical. Looking at it this way, the new Tabi are inferior only because the percent went down (though of course getting lucky can make dodge superior in certain circumstances).[/quote]

[quote=Temzilla][quote=lifebaka]So, statistically, the expected values dodge and damage reduction are identical. Looking at it this way, the new Tabi are inferior only because the percent went down (though of course getting lucky can make dodge superior in certain circumstances). [/quote] Pretty much.[/quote]

[quote=caucheka]they could also go unlucky and not dodge. simply put, while it might be a smaller number (2%) removing the rng makes it better.[/quote]

[quote=Temzilla][quote=caucheka] they could also go unlucky and not dodge. simply put, while it might be a smaller number (2%) removing the rng makes it better. [/quote] Fuck guys, stop making me proud, I'll start to tear up.[/quote]

[quote=Kurt_Ottman]^ What happened to profanity filter? O_o Anyway, I agree with those who have said that the new [[Ninja Tabi]] is better. The reason is that you are now able to evaluate strength more easily, instead of saying "ok, so I got 12% chance to win over this guy". The fact is, it's more reliable in every way, and I'll be surprised if you actually dodge 12% of the attacks that is thrown at you. The reason is that the dice is re-rolled every time they hit you with a basic attack. Every attack you only have 12% chance of dodging, meaning you will dodge almost no attacks at all, compared to how many times you get hit. If say, you tested a game where you got hit 100 times, and see how many of those attacks were dodged, I'd bet it would be less than 10% in most cases, while we're 100% certain that 10% of the new [[ninja tabi]] attacks would be "dodged". Conclusion: - The new Ninja Tabi is more viable because they let you evaluate strengths to an increased extent. - You would have to be hit countless times for dodge to actually even out at 12%, while in most cases you would probably dodge less. - You're 100% certain that the new Ninja Tabi will dodge 10% of all basic attacks thrown at you (on avarage damage output, which is quite high). - The old Ninja Tabi was also counterable to an increased extent, because of [[Sword of the divine]] and all abilities (it's not confirmed if on-hit abilities counts for the new damage reduction or not).[/quote]

[quote=Somalie]If you would be able to force someone to waste his money and time to buy a sword of the divine by building tabi, you had an advantage. Top ad + bot ad + jungler AD, 3 of 5 champ had to build to counter the boots+runes+masteries of one 1 guy. Pretty good deal for the team of the tabi's buyer. Not even mentionning the cost of SotD and the not-so-good passive stats, where tabi's were just boos (cheap, dodge armor and lvl 2 boots) That's the reason why riot removed dodge : so hard to counter, and this stat countered so godly AD/AS/crit based cham [quote]In an extremely high level of play, consistency is always better than random number generation.[/quote] Absolutely false. Watch Kiev right now, the tide of the game can be turned on one single fight (with 2 teams equaly good.) 3 dodges in a row, fight really changed -> gamechanging. Nothing like that can happen with damage reduction. I dont freely spit on tabi as they are right now, they are still a nice part of build in a counterbuild way of thinking I dont even talk about some statistic fail there are in this thread, some math professor would die with an heart attack reading all the thread :D[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime][quote=Temzilla] In an extremely high level of play, consistency is always better than random number generation. Tournament play is not about potential, it is about expected value. DR > Dodge because of that. [/quote] Lmfao. You tell yourself that xP[/quote]