New Jungle - what does it mean?!

[quote=Temzilla][quote=Searz] [quote=DuffTime] It does "Make them stronger" but it removes part of the fundamental aspect of their strength which is their ease and capability of clearing what used to be a more difficult jungle. [/quote] Yes and no. The fast ones have much more freedom in items and can thus get even faster or get other advantages. I believe the fast ones and good gankers will be the strongest junglers. [/quote] Translation: Unless they make it impossible, Nocturne will always be an amazing jungler.[/quote]

[quote=Nighthawk]Gankers are relatively stronger now since they can farm easier, get their items and then gank. Also people who can do dragon really early while still being high hp (like Udyr) are much much better now.[/quote]

[quote=Xenasis][quote=Nighthawk] Gankers are relatively stronger now since they can farm easier, get their items and then gank. [/quote] On the contrary, by the time the farm takes effect, the stage in which you gank is over. Farming junglers are the best, followed by control junglers who can duel well, followed by ganking and control. Not an exciting metagame.[/quote]

[quote=Nighthawk][quote=Xenasis] [quote=Nighthawk] Gankers are relatively stronger now since they can farm easier, get their items and then gank. [/quote] On the contrary, by the time the farm takes effect, the stage in which you gank is over. Farming junglers are the best, followed by control junglers who can duel well, followed by ganking and control. Not an exciting metagame. [/quote] Wrong :P Gankers farm the jungle, then gank/counter jungle, then farm, then gank, etc. The laning phase can go on for a long time too :P[/quote]

[quote=InfHaRM]In my opinion the only good thing about the new jungle is the fact that you can almost jungle with no runes or masteries.[/quote]

[quote=Freddy Shopan]I'll tell you what the new jungle means. >:D JUNGLE KARTHUS OP. But seriously... his clear is stupid fast.[/quote]

[quote=Xenasis][quote=Nighthawk] Wrong :P Gankers farm the jungle, then gank/counter jungle, then farm, then gank, etc. The laning phase can go on for a long time too :P [/quote] Can I have some justification for that? Farming is so good now because there's so much gold/XP in the jungle, but since ganks have been nerfed, counter jungling's been practically removed, and there's nobody to stop farmers any more, they can farm all day. Basically, the Triad of junglers used to go Farmers beat Gankers Gankers beat Control Junglers Control Junglers beat Farmers And now, it goes - Farmers beat Gankers and Control Junglers Control Junglers that can duel (since everyone's at full health now so you can't get sneaky kills like you could before) sometimes beat Farmers or Gankers if they're exceptionally good.[/quote]

[quote=Nighthawk]Ah, but there isn't as much gold/exp in the jungle (until Riot hotfixes) as there used to be. That's why ganks have been nerfed, you have to make the most out of your jungle. Counter jungling hasn't been removed quite yet but you need to take more then just 1 wraith or sth to make an impact.[/quote]

[quote=Xenasis][quote=Nighthawk] Ah, but there isn't as much gold/exp in the jungle (until Riot hotfixes) as there used to be. That's why ganks have been nerfed, you have to make the most out of your jungle. Counter jungling hasn't been removed quite yet but you need to take more then just 1 wraith or sth to make an impact. [/quote] There is as much gold/XP, and respawns, you just have to sit in your jungle longer to reap the rewards, and if you gank or counter jungle, you lose out on it. THAT's why ganking's been nerfed, along with the red buff nerf. Counter jungling really, really has been removed. If you take one wraith then you were stupid in the first place, but honestly, Wraiths, Golems, and the occasional buff were all you ever stole, any more and you'd EASILY be spotted by a CV and tracked down, not to mention lacking XP and gold yourself, unlike pre-patch. As you say, it's not worth counter jungling unless you take the whole lot, which is practically impossible if you're against anybody that isn't mentally retarded.[/quote]

[quote=InfHaRM][quote=Xenasis] There is as much gold/XP, and respawns, you just have to sit in your jungle longer to reap the rewards, and if you gank or counter jungle, you lose out on it. THAT's why ganking's been nerfed, along with the red buff nerf. Counter jungling really, really has been removed. If you take one wraith then you were stupid in the first place, but honestly, Wraiths, Golems, and the occasional buff were all you ever stole, any more and you'd EASILY be spotted by a CV and tracked down, not to mention lacking XP and gold yourself, unlike pre-patch. As you say, it's not worth counter jungling unless you take the whole lot, which is practically impossible if you're against anybody that isn't mentally retarded. [/quote] That[/quote]