Ninja Tabi stand better on itself now? Buffed...

[quote=DuffTime][quote=Kurt_Ottman] Conclusion: - The new Ninja Tabi is more viable because they let you evaluate strengths to an increased extent. - You would have to be hit countless times for dodge to actually even out at 12%, while in most cases you would probably dodge less. - You're 100% certain that the new Ninja Tabi will dodge 10% of all basic attacks thrown at you (on avarage damage output, which is quite high). - The old Ninja Tabi was also counterable to an increased extent, because of [[Sword of the divine]] and all abilities (it's not confirmed if on-hit abilities counts for the new damage reduction or not). [/quote] Congratulations, your conclusion is absolutely wrong. The new Ninja Tabi is still good, but rather -bad- when compared to the old Ninja Tabi.[/quote]

[quote=lifebaka]Just wondering, but does anyone know if the new [[Ninja Tabi]] passive affects on-hit effects? I assume this isn't the case (which makes dodge far superior), but would like confirmation.[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime]It actually might factor in on hit effects as well. I assume they considered all of that. I don't know one way or the other, but my gut says it probably does.[/quote]

[quote=Kurt_Ottman][quote=DuffTime] [quote=Kurt_Ottman] Conclusion: - The new Ninja Tabi is more viable because they let you evaluate strengths to an increased extent. - You would have to be hit countless times for dodge to actually even out at 12%, while in most cases you would probably dodge less. - You're 100% certain that the new Ninja Tabi will dodge 10% of all basic attacks thrown at you (on avarage damage output, which is quite high). - The old Ninja Tabi was also counterable to an increased extent, because of [[Sword of the divine]] and all abilities (it's not confirmed if on-hit abilities counts for the new damage reduction or not). [/quote] Congratulations, your conclusion is absolutely wrong. The new Ninja Tabi is still good, but rather -bad- when compared to the old Ninja Tabi. [/quote] Thanks for the ironic remark, care to back it up?[/quote]

[quote=lifebaka][quote=DuffTime] It actually might factor in on hit effects as well. I assume they considered all of that. I don't know one way or the other, but my gut says it probably does. [/quote] Regardless of whether or not the new passive reduces on-hit damage, it still wouldn't be as good as dodge. When you dodged an attack, all the on-hits were negated. So no slow from [[Ashe]]'s [[Frost Shot]]s or from [[Frozen Mallet]], no armor/MR shred from [[The Black Cleaver]] or [[Malady]], et cetera et cetera. It seems clear that these effects aren't reduced by the Tabi's new damage reduction, even if the bonus damage from something like [[Wit's End]] might be (and I still assume that it isn't). Still, I'll see if I can test it in a custom game.[/quote]

[quote=Yukimaru][quote=lifebaka] [quote=DuffTime] It actually might factor in on hit effects as well. I assume they considered all of that. I don't know one way or the other, but my gut says it probably does. [/quote] Regardless of whether or not the new passive reduces on-hit damage, it still wouldn't be as good as dodge. When you dodged an attack, all the on-hits were negated. So no slow from [[Ashe]]'s [[Frost Shot]]s or from [[Frozen Mallet]], no armor/MR shred from [[The Black Cleaver]] or [[Malady]], et cetera et cetera. It seems clear that these effects aren't reduced by the Tabi's new damage reduction, even if the bonus damage from something like [[Wit's End]] might be (and I still assume that it isn't). Still, I'll see if I can test it in a custom game. [/quote] You sure bout on-hit effects&Tabi? Cuz Vaynes Silver Bolts still proct if i remember correctly.[/quote]

[quote=Luther3000]Udyr's bear stance stun and Xin Zhao's Q knockup still hit if they were dodged as well.[/quote]

[quote=Dr Kasper]The argument in this thread is if the new tabi is better than the old tabi... Mathematically they are exactly the same, As i have proved in my equations. Yet for any one event (ANY ONE ATTACK), you must factor in the following: - What if? --> That attack would've hit you for crit, but you avoided 100% of the damage - What if? --> That attack caused any disabiling condition (stun, blind, etc), but you avoided it completely [you dodged it] - What if? --> The gods of randomness f'd you in the b and you didn't dodge ANY attacks in a series of events, effictively reducing 0% of damage. For my tastes, one too many what if's. Read this article on something called "Gambler's Ruin" It's chaos theory that runs on mathematical models. Events ALWAYS run with patterns, so for any one fight, you WILL get random "strings" of dodges and random "strings" of nothing. I always used dodge on my Malph, because since he takes so much damage reduction anyway, having a random event offer me a 100% damage reduction was sweet, because he's in the thick of things all the times, and the possiblity of stringing random events of dodge was higher than say a AP carry or a ranged melee figher. Course, if we go into the argument if dodge was better on JAX, that is a completely different thread altogether, because Jax's abilities raised his dodge stats along with runes to very high levels of dodge probability.[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime]Spike impact is just functionally better than sustained effect.[/quote]

[quote=Kurt_Ottman]Not if evaluating if fighting [[Master Yi]] with 300 hp left is wise or not. I wouldn't even dream about it with dodge chance! And it's just an example, so don't drag that "fighting someone with 300hp left is never wise" stuff. It's just an example, k? :)[/quote]