Support talk.

[quote=Joshified][[Morgana]] really isn't anything at the moment.. And [[Nautilus]] isn't really a support, he would push the lane so hard with every single attempt at an engage o.x Though his CC is glorious. Also, [[Nautilus]] wouldn't be able to afford tank items to be strong at any point in the game besides maybe the start... Support [[LeBlanc]] is interesting, extremely aggresive playstyle, tons of CC, decent damage and impossible to catch. Eh. I might chuck her in low tier 3, but she is REALLY gimmicky, even more so than [[Fiddlesticks]].[/quote]

[quote=MyRepublic]I honestly would swap blitz with ali. That's all. As to which works better on paper i refer you here: http://www.lolking.net/charts?region=all&league=ranked&type=bottom-lane-synergy&range=daily. It's blitz. Ali just feels too weak to compete, whereas a good (i'm assuming this is with a competent player on each support) blitz is extremely useful in lane and out. Ali just doesn't deserve to be tier 2 atm. It's sad because I like to play him, but it's true.[/quote]

[quote=Joshified][quote=MyRepublic] I honestly would swap blitz with ali. That's all. As to which works better on paper i refer you here: http://www.lolking.net/charts?region=all&league=ranked&type=bottom-lane-synergy&range=daily. It's blitz. Ali just feels too weak to compete, whereas a good (i'm assuming this is with a competent player on each support) blitz is extremely useful in lane and out. Ali just doesn't deserve to be tier 2 atm. It's sad because I like to play him, but it's true. [/quote] I am reluctant, but I do agree with you. [[Alistar]] just doesn't have the same presence that he did in season 2. While I still think his peel is insanely strong and when his bot lane gets gank it is almost a guaranteed kill. Blitz is just too strong to compete with.. those grabs can instantly turn a game to win.[/quote]

[quote=DarkPercy]My opinion: [[alistar]] isn't nearly as good as before. I would put him t3. [[blitzcrank]] never got his hook utiliy nerfed, he's still tier 1 support to me. I think you're having a hard time placing [[lux]] as a support because her performance is pretty much literally 100% reliant on the player's skills. [[soraka]] can be played as an aggressive and very powerful support. If you want the proof, go look at ''KirbyCake''. He/she plays only [[soraka]], always maxes [[starcall]] first, goes [[flash]] + [[barrier]] and carries his games all day every day. He/she has been Diamond I for a while now. I even played with him/her once :D. So yeah, I wouldn't say [[soraka]] is the ''worst'' support of all those you listed. Most supports are situational picks. For example, why would you put [[elise]] as a tier 3 support when she is getting picked in tournaments quite regularly :P. It's gotta be powerful. Some supports can be ''the best'' support but only in certain situations... that's kinda why I dislike tier lists with ''Tier 1, tier 2, tier 3'' as the tier names. People can just argue all day and basically any support could be in the #1 tier really... The only way I think a tier list should be made is with specific names for each tier, like Stonewall will do with his jungle tier list. For example: ''Sustain'', ''Peel'', ''Poke''. I don't know, stuff like that. Also, I think there is no mention of support [[leblanc]] in your main post. She is also being used in tournaments.[/quote]

[quote=Pheyniex]you will hardly get a nerf in utility. imo, that's nearly equivalent to getting rid of the grab effect. Making [[Rocket Grab]] cost half his lvl1 mana pool was a big enough blow to him, even if you aren't to simply spam it, since it interferes with his passive. Actually this almost makes it a double nerf. Also, he can't simply grab. WHo's the target is as important as grabbing. Also there are ways to counterplay it, namely standing behind minions 24/7. Not really tier1 atm, imo, if I have to tier it.[/quote]

[quote=DarkPercy][quote=Pheyniex] you will hardly get a nerf in utility. imo, that's nearly equivalent to getting rid of the grab effect. Making [[Rocket Grab]] cost half his lvl1 mana pool was a big enough blow to him, even if you aren't to simply spam it, since it interferes with his passive. Actually this almost makes it a double nerf. Also, he can't simply grab. WHo's the target is as important as grabbing. Also there are ways to counterplay it, namely standing behind minions 24/7. Not really tier1 atm, imo, if I have to tier it. [/quote] My opinion is probably very biased because I hate [[blitzcrank]]. Like, I don't just ''Dislike'' playing against him, I consider leaving the game when I play against [[blitzcrank]]. I completely hate his design and I think he's a stupid champion that makes no sense at all. [[[rant]]]. (I've been saying all this for 2+ years too) Mana costs are a joke to [[blitzcrank]] when all you have to do really is stand in a bush and completely zone the enemy. Also, his weakness is mana costs but his passive makes it incredibly powerful and worth it to buy mana on him (which again I think is stupid and retarded design) so his mana costs become a non-factor. And the ''stand behind minions'' is such an old and bad argument. That's like saying ''lol [[nidalee]] is bad, just dodge her spears'' or ''lol [[lux]] is bad, just dodge her shots''. Even pros eventually get hit by those, no matter how good they are. So you will eventually get hit by a [[blitzcrank]] hook, no matter how good you are at this game, and whenever you get grabbed by Blitz, there's a really f***ing huge chance that you will die instantly right after. Hit a skillshot, get a kill. Retarded design. Oh and even if he doesn't land a single hook on you in the laning phase, he still forced you to miss CS/ play passive all laning phase long. And then later he just throws a random grab over the wall, instantly gets rid of one of your teammates, turns the fight into 4v5, gets Baron, wins the game. Oh and you could think that having SUCH a powerful CC ability on such a low cooldown would make him deal low damage? lol jk he has more burst than almost every support -[[[/rant]]] I get nightmares when I face a [[blitzcrank]] main in diamond games ;~;[/quote]