OP/UP champs and who are they?

[quote=JEFFY40HANDS][quote=DuffTime] No bro. You can tell me I'm wrong, but if you think it's just an opinion of mine, then why bother? Here, let's just flip the switch. You're wrong, because Akali crushes his face, denies him farm in lane, and that counters him. A Singed with no farm is useless. He's probably the most farm dependent champ outside of AD carries. Denying him farm is in and of itself countering him. You can talk about mechanics and yadiyadi and how you need to be a mechanical direct counter, but what it really boils down to is that yes, if you win lane hard enough to deny farm, you are a counter. You can zooooooom into the tiniest detail and decide that your definition is king and all other interpretations of the word, "Counter" are incorrect, but that really doesn't affect me in any way, and I'm still going to tell people Akali counters Singed. Because she does. [/quote] QFT +1[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime]Sides, Vayne's bolts counter everything. She was just designed to be able to carry against anything equally well. That's why they do both a static physical amount and a % of true damage to boot. ^^[/quote]

[quote=JunSupport][quote=DuffTime] No bro. You can tell me I'm wrong, but if you think it's just an opinion of mine, then why bother? Here, let's just flip the switch. You're wrong, because Akali crushes his face, denies him farm in lane, and that counters him. [color=#ffff00]Doesn't work. Your claims aren't backed up. I've seen Singeds lane against Akalis before. It's a matter of individual skill. Not the champion.[/color] A Singed with no farm is useless. He's probably the most farm dependent champ outside of AD carries. Denying him farm is in and of itself countering him. [color=#ffff00]This point is moot because I just rendered your premise invalid.[/color] You can talk about mechanics and yadiyadi and how you need to be a mechanical direct counter, but what it really boils down to is that yes, if you win lane hard enough to deny farm, you are a counter. [color=#ffff00]Winning the lane when the specific kits don't counter each other mean it's all about player skill. Not the champion kit. If this is the case, then even Evelynn hard counters Singed because the Singed player was an idiot and the Evelynn player was 2000+ ELO If you ONLY win the lane. It's not a counter. It's skill. Big difference. Picking a specific counter more greatly affects your ability to dominate a lane. A champion who actually mechanically counters Singed would beat Singed BETTER then Akali can. A counter is someone you pick BECAUSE the enemy picked Singed in draft. Akali doesn't fill any criteria for that. Sure, you could send her to lane against him, but that doesn't mean squat about actually picking a champion to balance out your team when you see Singed on the enemy team.[/color] You can zooooooom into the tiniest detail and decide that your definition is king and all other interpretations of the word, "Counter" are incorrect, but that really doesn't affect me in any way, and I'm still going to tell people Akali counters Singed. [color=#ffff00]Denial of definitions. If you don't state your interpretation of the term, or accept mine, it just means you're incapable of discussing things logically. What if people stopped differentiating between water and soil? or Considered Blitzcrank the same as Heimerdinger because they were both yellow? or that Garen counters Veigar because he's bigger? It doesn't work that way. Logic and detail clearly define everything. If you choose to ignore it, and say whatever you want, it means one of two things: 1. You're wrong. 2. It's only an opinion. And as I said already, opinions have nothing to theorycraft or strategy. And I'm not saying whatever I want. I speak from knowledge of researching champions I'm interested in and experiences of what actually occurs in-game.[/color] Because she does. [color=#ffff00]Again. Failure to explain anything[/color] [/quote] Replies in Gold If you don't back up what you say with facts that say more then: "She does" and "Because she crushes his face" then it's just your opinion. Therefore, it has no relevance to the reality of how things work. [color=#ffff00]You can't flip that back on me because I'm not making claims without backing them up. You are. ^_^[/color] I CAN and AM telling you that you're wrong AND that it's your opinion because you make a statement of fact [u]based[/u] on an opinion. If we were discussing something philosophical, maybe it'd work out. But noooo, League of Legends is a game, built on numbers, rules, and clear-cut designs. [b]Akali does not counter Singed. She's just a good match-up against him because her early burst damage is good against virtually anyone without any sustain.[/b] If you make claims without actually being prepared to explain your reasoning in detail, you just set yourself up to look stupid. (or more stupid, if you let yourself repeat)[/quote]

[quote=JakofAllSpaydes]I dont see how akali counters singed in any way.....[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime]Okay then we're done here. Akali counters Singed. GG. I'm not the only one who thinks/feels that way. It's the opinion of myself and pretty much the entire "High Elo" world. Your personal experience in the lane with Singed vrs Akali is irrelevant.[/quote]

[quote=Lugignaf]Umm... Akali+Singed= half dead Akali. As soon as a good Singed sees an Akali, he's just going to build standard. Maybe throw in an extra MR item or two. 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of Akali's damage is magic. The only chase tool she has is her slow from her shroud or the slow from crystal Scepter. Her ult shouldn't be used to jump a tank.[/quote]

[quote=JunSupport]@Dufftime: There you go, making statements without backing it up again. It's not just my personal experience. I watch people on streams! Singed vs Akali. It's all about how the Akali player plays. Akali's actual skills don't threaten Singed at all outside of raw damage. Unlike you, I speak from proper referencing, I don't pull my logic out of thin air. And now you're just BS'ing. "entire High Elo world" - Since when do you have the support of the entire 1500+ community? Hyperbole aside, it's still not true either. If you ask for a counter to Singed from high ELO communities, people won't say "Akali". It's just you. [color=#ffff00]I have asked you several times now to EXPLAIN why you think Akali is a counter to Singed. You have refused to do so at all, something that should be a simple task if your statement is true at all. That can only mean one thing. You've got nothing.[/color] "Akali counters Singed. GG" - You don't even try to prove it. Just you saying it [u]doesn't make it truth. [/u] [color=#ffff00]You're all talk, no reality, no support. You're delusional.[/color] And, we're not done unless I have the last say, kay? As long as you keep replying with the same empty statements, I will keep making rebuttals. I don't like people who talk nonsense in theorycraft. If you actually start replying with real explanations that show your thought process, maybe then we can have a civilized discussion instead of what resembles a primitive one. @Lugignaf: Fun Fact: [[Crescent Slash]] deals physical damage! :o[/quote]

[quote=Keels]Sorry, I have a lot to say here. I don't really think any champ is OP... I think it's just why players call pubstomp characters like Kat or tryndamere OP, because they don't know how to handle them. Fiddlesticks... Fuck Fiddlesticks. Fuck him so hard. I hate fucking Fiddlesticks. 3 second fear then 2 second silence my ass. Ummmmm.... he's the only character I truly hate, but most I see suck. Amumu isn't OP, if you fuck with him in the jungle, then he's going to be screwed over. But yes, his late game is insane, yes, his ult is disgusting. I feel bad for playing him, but at least he's banned constantly, so I just play cho'gath. UP? Well there's your awful stealth chars... I actually think TF is UP. Teemo is outclassed in pretty much any category, so I think he needs a buff on his AA range to make him a competent AD char again. AD was a little worse than AP imo for a long time, but then dat shroom nerf...@_@ Morde isn't OP... just really IMBA and frustrating to lane against. Veigar is like Pre-retouch Annie- a nuker with outdated mana costs. Needs a bit of a rework, then he'll be in a good place.[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime]Lol Jun? You're more of a troll than I realized. You're trying your damnedest to provoke me for the sake of provoking me. Have your last say, and in fact, post another response with gold type for all I care. Have fun at it.[/quote]

[quote=Lugignaf][quote=JunSupport] @Lugignaf: Fun Fact: [[Crescent Slash]] deals physical damage! :o [/quote] Exactly. That's why I didn't do 100% and stuck with a very safe 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% Apparently, that skill is a waste of energy. :/[/quote]