Need some tips to improve as a main support player

[quote=Stomper](all this is just my opinion, by the way) Well, itemization is pretty important. Items: Never buy a Ruby Sightstone because there's a 3 ward limit anyways and you're probably never getting full built. Sell your Warding Trinket for a Sweeping Lens after getting blue Stone. Anticipate this before you back, if it's off CD lay down the trinket ward since you're selling it anyways. Talisman is 90% of the time the item to get on Thresh (looks like you main Thresh). Doran's Shield is just a stupid first item, combined with 21 in the defense tree and your runes AA's hit for like 10 damage. Items with actives are obviously great on every support- Randuin's for Armor, Mikael's or Twin Shadows for MR (depending on if you're carry hunting or carry peeling). Mobi's or Mercs are generally the boots to get, Mobi's really help with map control and getting picks off on priority targets. Gameplay: (Thresh and Lulu specifically) Bop them on the head a lot, your AA's hurt so much. Don't let your ADC get 1v1'd by their support in lane. Don't overlook Pinks. Don't telegraph jungle ganks, especially as Thresh the lantern throw can be pretty obvious. Learn to read when a gank is getting telegraphed so you can run away. Don't let Dragon slip away under your nose, and if you notice the enemy team is sloppy with Dragon just take it over and over again.[/quote]

[quote=Mooninites][quote=IceCreamy] Spellthief's Edge is only good on [[Sona]] and [[Lulu]] imo. [/quote] You have to play pretty much flawlessly to use spellthief's edge on [[sona]]. She got nerfed pretty hard. I prefer running 0/21/9 with a [[doran's shield]] start on her, pretty much gets her through laning phase even with the likes of [[annie]], [[thresh]], [[leona]] I tried spellthief's on [[lulu]] I really didn't care for it. I actually think it's pretty good on [[Zyra]] because it can proc off her plants, multiple times depending on how many targets it hits.[/quote]

[quote=SOAC Bas]1) [[Doran's Shield]] is not mandatory unless you are playing against a high poke comp. Then it's really advisable, but if you are playing against and [[annie]] and [[jinx]] or another group that won't auto attack you a lot than it's wasted. 2) Never buy [[Ruby Sightstone]] someone stated why above. You just will never need it, and with the influx of gold it will be much easier to buy the 1 sight stone. Also only buy it on tankier champs or if you find yourself getting hurt a lot. 3) Always Buy [[Mercury's Treads]] unless there is zero cc or zero ap damage. If there is even a little bit of AP damage than [[mercury's Treads]] is better than just about any other boots. 4) Buy your gear after [[talisman of ascension]] based on how the lane is going. If you are getting poked a lot than buy armor. If you are playing well go for more damage. 5) Never put a pink in your tri-bush unless you can put it with visibility on dragon. I generally only put a pink in three locations that grant me visibility over key spots all game. Otherwise it's just free gold for the opposing team. 6) Keep an eye on your ADC. You don't want to play aggressive if they are passive and so on. 7) Don't bug your jungler for a gank. If your lane is pushed and you have no wards, and can't tell him where the wards the opposing team dropped are positioned than it's not his fault that he has't ganked yet. He knows you are there, and he can see what is going on.[/quote]

[quote=Nebrasketball]I feel that dorans shield is mandatory vs the current trifecta of supports. Its getting nerfed so ruby crystal + pot could be used against non poke lanes.[/quote]

[quote=Mooninites][quote=SOAC Bas] 1) [[Doran's Shield]] is not mandatory unless you are playing against a high poke comp. Then it's really advisable, but if you are playing against and [[annie]] and [[jinx]] or another group that won't auto attack you a lot than it's wasted. 2) Never buy [[Ruby Sightstone]] someone stated why above. You just will never need it, and with the influx of gold it will be much easier to buy the 1 sight stone. Also only buy it on tankier champs or if you find yourself getting hurt a lot. 3) Always Buy [[Mercury's Treads]] unless there is zero cc or zero ap damage. If there is even a little bit of AP damage than [[mercury's Treads]] is better than just about any other boots. 4) Buy your gear after [[talisman of ascension]] based on how the lane is going. If you are getting poked a lot than buy armor. If you are playing well go for more damage. 5) Never put a pink in your tri-bush unless you can put it with visibility on dragon. I generally only put a pink in three locations that grant me visibility over key spots all game. Otherwise it's just free gold for the opposing team. 6) Keep an eye on your ADC. You don't want to play aggressive if they are passive and so on. 7) Don't bug your jungler for a gank. If your lane is pushed and you have no wards, and can't tell him where the wards the opposing team dropped are positioned than it's not his fault that he has't ganked yet. He knows you are there, and he can see what is going on. [/quote] So much of this is just absolute crap. 1. [[Doran's Shield]] is extremely efficient in it's current state (it is getting nerfed though). 440 gold for 100 health and 10 health regen on top of the block effect. That's extremely good even for a champion that doesn't auto attack. Also who the fuck doesn't auto on [[Annie]] or [[Jinx]]? Like what type of players are you playing against? Also, it's still fine against champions that "don't auto often" because it makes you tankier for an all-in. 2. Upgrading to [[Ruby Sightstone]] is fine later in the game; once the laning phase ends and if you have nothing else to really buy. 3. INCORRECT. So many supports use [[Ninja Tabi]] or [[Boots of Mobility]]. Even [[Sorcerer's Shoes]] are a fine option on some supports. Merc Treads are really good, but to say that you should always buy them or that they are the absolute best is wrong. 5. This is fucking idiotic. Pinking tri-brush is fine. It gives your jungler access into bot lane, and it's alot more defensible than pinking dragon. Obviously you want to pink dragon for when you do it, but dropping a pink in tri is fine. If anything it makes the enemy feel insecure. 6. Wrong. Playing aggressive is fine, as long as you do it in a safe manner. You want to be on the same page as your ADC, but you also want to draw pressure off your ADC, if you're the aggressor you can easily draw pressure off the ADC allowing him to farm or harass more easily. 7. You're not bugging your jungler if you can pull a successful gank off. Obviously if you're pushed up, have no vision and don't know where their vision is you shouldn't ask for a gank, but asking for a gank in general is fine.[/quote]

[quote=sirell]Itemwise, the general idea is to rush your gold item and get a stable income. That is, if you don't use the [[doran's shield]] start. Second priority (or first priority if you started D-Shield) is usually to rush [[sightstone]] for the slot and gold efficiency, although there are situations where it might be more prudent to rush something else (I think this is usually a [[chalice of harmony]]). Swap your Warding Totem for the Lens and you're pretty much set. After that, it's pretty situational.[/quote]

[quote=SOAC Bas][quote=Mooninites] So much of this is just absolute crap. 1. [[Doran's Shield]] is extremely efficient in it's current state (it is getting nerfed though). 440 gold for 100 health and 10 health regen on top of the block effect. That's extremely good even for a champion that doesn't auto attack. Also who the fuck doesn't auto on [[Annie]] or [[Jinx]]? Like what type of players are you playing against? Also, it's still fine against champions that "don't auto often" because it makes you tankier for an all-in. 2. Upgrading to [[Ruby Sightstone]] is fine later in the game; once the laning phase ends and if you have nothing else to really buy. 3. INCORRECT. So many supports use [[Ninja Tabi]] or [[Boots of Mobility]]. Even [[Sorcerer's Shoes]] are a fine option on some supports. Merc Treads are really good, but to say that you should always buy them or that they are the absolute best is wrong. 5. This is fucking idiotic. Pinking tri-brush is fine. It gives your jungler access into bot lane, and it's alot more defensible than pinking dragon. Obviously you want to pink dragon for when you do it, but dropping a pink in tri is fine. If anything it makes the enemy feel insecure. 6. Wrong. Playing aggressive is fine, as long as you do it in a safe manner. You want to be on the same page as your ADC, but you also want to draw pressure off your ADC, if you're the aggressor you can easily draw pressure off the ADC allowing him to farm or harass more easily. 7. You're not bugging your jungler if you can pull a successful gank off. Obviously if you're pushed up, have no vision and don't know where their vision is you shouldn't ask for a gank, but asking for a gank in general is fine. [/quote] I am not sure why you agreeed with me while saying it's mostly crap. 1) I said it's not mandatory. Being efficient and mandatory are not the same thing. Neither Jinx or Annie will auto attack you a lot in the early game. They may poke with abilities, but they don't have the range to trade auto attacks. What part of don't auto attack a lot confuses you? Saying they won't do it often and don't do it at all are not the same thing. You need to learn what certain words mean before you speak. 2). So essentially your thought is to spend money on something you don't need once you have bought everything you could possibly buy and there is nothing left to buy. Thanks for the advice! Perfectly sensible to waste money on something when you don't have anything else to spend money on. Do you hear yourself? 3). There is zero reason to buy [[Ninja Tabi]] over [[Mercury Treads]] unless the opposing team has no CC and or only AD. I can see [[boots of mobility]] if you are ahead, and [[sorceror's shoes]] only is better on Annie and again that's situational. My point still stands you always buy Treads unless the specific situations indicate you need to do otherwise. It's funny because you jumped all over me and then slowly started limiting your reasons. 5). So something is idiotic, but more advisable is what you are saying. You just countered your own statement. Doing it is fine but dragon is better. So you have two pinks for some reason. Pinking tri is essentially giving 30 gold to the opposing support who is going to drop a temp ward in there see the pink and either force you to engage on it or go get it anyways. In what world do you live in that the opposing support isn't clearing your wards whenever he can. Can I play there because it's much easier than playing team play. Heck in most 5v5 games you don't see a pink until really late in the game because you don't want to give the opposing team free gold that early. Calling something idiotic while countering your own statement is quite humorous and only proves that those who call things stupid the most are generally unable to understand concepts that are beyond basic. 6). You said exactly what I said while telling me I was wrong. Bravo!! 7). I am not sure if you understand basic word definition. Bug and Ask are not the same thing. Bugging is repeatedly asking for something when there is no reason or profit in it. Asking is simply requesting something you need. Does this make it easier for you to understand? If not I can try to use 3 letter words just for you. Essentially you said I was full of crap then typed exactly what I said in 4 of your five points, and in one of them I still stand by my statment in a majority of situations [[Mercury treads]] are the best choice. This makes them the best boots. There are very few champs that profit from [[boots of mobility]] and really only annie profits more from [[sorceror's shoes]] in terms of support.[/quote]

[quote=sirell]1) [[jinx]] and [[annie]] DO autoattack a lot in the laning phase. 2) If you have the random 600g, then why not upgrade your [[sightstone]] to [[ruby sightstone]]? It's not as if that 600g is immediately better contributed to something else. And he specifically said after the laning phase. 3) [[ninja tabi]] is miles cheaper than [[mercury's treads]] as well as some really efficient anti-autoattack defence. [[sorcerer's shoes]] also works on other AP-oriented supports such as [[morgana]], [[elise]], [[fiddlesticks]] and so on. Basically anyone with decent base AP damage. 5) This is just a judgement call. If you feel you can establish control over their map by pinking it, then by all means do so. Wouldn't say it was always a bad idea, but then again, it's not always a good idea. 6) Actually, that's not what you said. You said, 'don't play aggressive if they are playing passive'. Moon said, 'playing aggressive is fine as long as you do it safely'. The two are not mutually inclusive. I can play aggressively against a passive enemy so long as I do it safely. 7) Now you're just playing with semantics for no real reason and there's also a case of you redefining a word to suit your own needs. In this case, bugging and asking are not necessarily mutually exclusive. Bugging can simply be rephrased as 'asking repeatedly' or even just 'asking'. Given the context of the word, you can sometimes just outright replace 'asking' with 'bugging' to the exact same effect. If such is the case, then asking and bugging can be the same thing.[/quote]

[quote=SOAC Bas][quote=sirell] 1) [[jinx]] and [[annie]] DO autoattack a lot in the laning phase. 2) If you have the random 600g, then why not upgrade your [[sightstone]] to [[ruby sightstone]]? It's not as if that 600g is immediately better contributed to something else. And he specifically said after the laning phase. 3) [[ninja tabi]] is miles cheaper than [[mercury's treads]] as well as some really efficient anti-autoattack defence. [[sorcerer's shoes]] also works on other AP-oriented supports such as [[morgana]], [[elise]], [[fiddlesticks]] and so on. Basically anyone with decent base AP damage. 5) This is just a judgement call. If you feel you can establish control over their map by pinking it, then by all means do so. Wouldn't say it was always a bad idea, but then again, it's not always a good idea. 6) Actually, that's not what you said. You said, 'don't play aggressive if they are playing passive'. Moon said, 'playing aggressive is fine as long as you do it safely'. The two are not mutually inclusive. I can play aggressively against a passive enemy so long as I do it safely. 7) Now you're just playing with semantics for no real reason and there's also a case of you redefining a word to suit your own needs. In this case, bugging and asking are not necessarily mutually exclusive. Bugging can simply be rephrased as 'asking repeatedly' or even just 'asking'. Given the context of the word, you can sometimes just outright replace 'asking' with 'bugging' to the exact same effect. If such is the case, then asking and bugging can be the same thing. [/quote] 1). I rarely see it even in competitive LCS matches. They auto attack, but rarely at the rate of say Lulu/Karma/Cait and so on. 2) That's beyond the point. He was essentially calling my advice crap while pointing out a redundant situation. 3). Morgana is not a support and neither is Elise. Both are rarely played as support unless you get a player who has never supported or the good supports are banned. 5). It's a waste of 100gold early in the game anyway you look at it, and you give 30 gold to the team if they find it. It is neither efficient nor wise. It's better to stealth ward it. 6). I said if your adc is playing passive. Not if the counter laner is playing passive. This is the point that i was making, but thanks for pointing out if I wasn't clear when I referred to your adc as opposed to opposing adc. 7). I was not the one who confused semantics. He acted like I made a horrible statement when bugging and acting are not semantics bugging is not asking, and it can't even be linked together until the askign becomes repetitive. If you can't understand the difference between the two then you probably shouldn't be playing support.[/quote]

[quote=Luther3000][quote=SOAC Bas] 1) I said it's not mandatory. Being efficient and mandatory are not the same thing. Neither Jinx or Annie will auto attack you a lot in the early game. They may poke with abilities, but they don't have the range to trade auto attacks. What part of don't auto attack a lot confuses you? Saying they won't do it often and don't do it at all are not the same thing. You need to learn what certain words mean before you speak. [/quote] Except Jinx and Annie are literally the two longest range, most auto heavy bot laners in the game next to Caitlyn. o.O[/quote]