Support - Janna - Critique my item build

[quote=lanilwow]I'm currently level 24 and I really enjoy support. [[Janna]] is the one I am most comfortable with. I started playing normal games at level 23. I do Team Builder when I really want to make sure I have Janna. But I try to play normal blind when I fell like taking the chance and having to mix it up. Anyway... I am in need a critique of my item build. I hate to die and I find myself building defense in the heat of the battle. I see the pros and the guides always seem to recommend going full AP. Here is a link to my summoner at [url=http://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=jatatoma]Jataoma summoner profile @ opp.gg[/url] I know some of the other my champ's builds are really screwed up, but Janna is what I am working on right now. I have been doing [[boots of speed]] and 1 [[vision ward]] and 2 [[stealth ward]] on first back, [[frostfang]] if I have extra gold. On second back I often forget to finish [[Frost Queen's Claim]] and will start building [[Locket of the Iron Solari]]. But should I even build it that early? It has no AP, but it has CR and a small shield. If I die early or we are not getting bot lane kills then I hesitate to purchase [[Mejai's Soulstealer]] since I fear I won't build or hold the stacks. I think I might be thinking too defensive... Anyway, I'll shut up now and listen to someone who knows better than me =)[/quote]

[quote=xenLiam]The new [[mejai's soulstealer]] works wonders on Janna especially after it's new changes (5 stacks to start with + you're a support so you'll be getting at least 1 stack if you setup a play right). I would personally start off with a [[spellthief's edge]] and a couple of pots, then rush a [[sightstone]] and trade a trinket for the sweeper, then once I hit level 9, I upgrade the sweeper, get the Mejai's and finish the [[frost queen's claim]] if I can afford it. I haven't tried it myself, but have you considered [[zeke's herald]]? You're gonna need that to feed your carry if you're falling a bit behind.[/quote]

[quote=Vynertje]Diamond 3 support main here. Dont really agree with the comment above me. I'm away for the weekend so I can't answer now, but if you can repost the question in the thread I linked below I can answer when I'm back. In the meanwhile, you can check my op.gg (you can find my ign on my profile) to see what I build as well[/quote]

[quote=Slappiz]And here we have a Diamond 3 Janna main ;) ---> Your build is good but going for a early [[sightstone]] is often better than going boots early. I usually prioritize my core build in this order when I build it: vision/sightstone > movement speed > mana regen > cooldown reduction [b]Starting items:[/b] [[Nomad's Medallion]] 2x health potions and 2x mana potions or [[Spellthief's Edge]] 3x health potions and 1x mana potion. Starting ward at lvl 1 is mostly not needed unless they have really strong early ganks on bot lane and you think they are going to camp. [b]First time back:[/b] Most of the time [[sightstone]] and a few potions imo and ofc a [[vision ward]] if you have the gold for it. Sometimes you can pick up early [[boots of mobility]] and 1x[[Vision ward]] and 1x[[stealth ward]] if you plan to do some early offensive warding ([url=http://www.mobafire.com/league-of-legends/build/trust-me-im-a-weather-woman-377733]Check my Janna guide[/url]). Core builds: [[Frost Queen's Claim]] or [[Talisman of Ascension]] [[Ruby Sightstone]] [[Morellonomicon]] or [[Mikael's Crucible]] [[boots of mobility]] or [[Mercury's treads]] I'm not a big fan of [[Mejai's Soulstealer]] even tough my KDA is 5.21:1 in like 270 Janna games and I would be able to make it worth in the majority of my games. I do build it sometime if we are doing really good but most of the time I don't want to slow down my core stats.[/quote]

[quote=Vynertje][quote=Slappiz]And here we have a Diamond 3 Janna main ;) ---> Your build is good but going for a early [[sightstone]] is often better than going boots early. I usually prioritize my core build in this order when I build it: vision/sightstone > movement speed > mana regen > cooldown reduction [b]Starting items:[/b] [[Nomad's Medallion]] 2x health potions and 2x mana potions or [[Spellthief's Edge]] 3x health potions and 1x mana potion. Starting ward at lvl 1 is mostly not needed unless they have really strong early ganks on bot lane and you think they are going to camp. [b]First time back:[/b] Most of the time [[sightstone]] and a few potions imo and ofc a [[vision ward]] if you have the gold for it. Sometimes you can pick up early [[boots of mobility]] and 1x[[Vision ward]] and 1x[[stealth ward]] if you plan to do some early offensive warding ([url=http://www.mobafire.com/league-of-legends/build/trust-me-im-a-weather-woman-377733]Check my Janna guide[/url]). Core builds: [[Frost Queen's Claim]] or [[Talisman of Ascension]] [[Ruby Sightstone]] [[Morellonomicon]] or [[Mikael's Crucible]] [[boots of mobility]] or [[Mercury's treads]] I'm not a big fan of [[Mejai's Soulstealer]] even tough my KDA is 5.21:1 in like 270 Janna games and I would be able to make it worth in the majority of my games. I do build it sometime if we are doing really good but most of the time I don't want to slow down my core stats.[/quote] Actually managed to get hold of a computer so I could reply: I disagree with a few things here: I really don't like [[morellonomicon]] and/or [[frost queen's claim]] on a support as first core item for one single reason, and that's because you're a support: Your goal as a support is to give your team optimal circumstances to perform well, and that also means you're going to get more damage as a team if you just build stuff to make your team survive, rather than building damage yourself. Therefore [[mikael's crucible]] should IMO be your first item. Regarding boots, I usually get [[ionian boots of lucidity]] as IMO janna doesn't really need mobis and mercs are too expensive. You don't really need tenacity as a backline support that often. Since I skip [[morellonomicon]] I don't end up with over 40% CDR anytime soon anyway. My build would usually be: Start: [[spellthief's edge]]/[[ancient coin]] + 3x health pot + 1x mana pot Rush (in order) [[sightstone]] [[ionian boots of lucidity]] [[mikael's crucible]] Also always get: [[oracle's lens]] [[vision ward]] Situationals are [[locket of the iron solari]] (standard mr item), [[frozen heart]]/[[randuin's omen]] (depending on your CDR needs), [[banshee's veil]] (if you need heavy MR and are afraid of getting oneshot or cc locked) and [[talisman of ascension]] if you decided to go coin.[/quote]

[quote=lanilwow]Thank you for the replies! I had not posted this in your Vynertje, since you were going to be gone all weekend and I was lazy! =) + rep to both - y'all are giving me good stuff to think about. A couple of games ago I noticed that the [[boots of mobility]] greatly increased my (duh) mobility! I was able to go all over the map really fast... but I began to wonder if I really needed to go all these places that fast. Plus I was often out running my team and I would have to wait for them to catch up. Lucidity sound interesting. I was also not so happy about rushing [[Frost Queen's Claims]]. It felt like I was delaying something that might be more useful, I just wasn't sure what I should get instead. I'll review all the comments more in depth in a few hours and probably have more questions! Thanks again![/quote]

[quote=Slappiz][quote=lanilwow]A couple of games ago I noticed that the [[boots of mobility]] greatly increased my (duh) mobility! I was able to go all over the map really fast... but I began to wonder if I really needed to go all these places that fast. Plus I was often out running my team and I would have to wait for them to catch up. Lucidity sound interesting.[/quote] They all have pros and cons but I find myself roaming/rotating a lot and helps me do my warding safer and faster. [quote=lanilwow]I was also not so happy about rushing [[Frost Queen's Claims]]. It felt like I was delaying something that might be more useful, I just wasn't sure what I should get instead. [/quote] Imo you shouldn't rush it unless you really need the active, and that is pretty much never :P It's the last item I finish in my core build.[/quote]

[quote=Vynertje][quote=Slappiz][quote=lanilwow]A couple of games ago I noticed that the [[boots of mobility]] greatly increased my (duh) mobility! I was able to go all over the map really fast... but I began to wonder if I really needed to go all these places that fast. Plus I was often out running my team and I would have to wait for them to catch up. Lucidity sound interesting.[/quote] They all have pros and cons but I find myself roaming/rotating a lot and helps me do my warding safer and faster. [quote=lanilwow]I was also not so happy about rushing [[Frost Queen's Claims]]. It felt like I was delaying something that might be more useful, I just wasn't sure what I should get instead. [/quote] Imo you shouldn't rush it unless you really need the active, and that is pretty much never :P It's the last item I finish in my core build.[/quote] My point about mobis is just that it becomes overkill at some point (as you can get about 500 MS) and that I'd rather get something else at that point. Agreed on FQC, I actually sell the GP10 component in very late game for another defensive/aura item.[/quote]

[quote=Chawoora]Interesting info here. So you guys do not start with a [[Stealth Ward]]?? My standard start for support is 2 [[Health Potion]]s + GP10 item ([[Ancient Coin]] for [[Janna]]) + 1 [[Stealth Ward]]. It just seems like you are not going to back until ganking is well underway just the [[Warding Totem]] just does not seem to be enough.[/quote]

[quote=The_Nameless_Bard]There are two [[warding totem]]s bot lane (or there should be) and that's plenty. The extra sustain from the potions is overall better. When I see a squishy support, in particular, who's started with a ward instead of two more potions (happens a lot in Silver and it's so easy to abuse) I can just poke/harass them out of lane because they don't have the sustain to handle that.[/quote]