Champions that need to be mastered?

[quote=XnMiller]Zio, try tanky AP like rumble or mord.[/quote]

[quote=ZioSerpe]I personally don't like rumble, and yeah I do a pretty great morde (not that he's hard to master)[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime]Yeah GP actually almost feels underwhelming right now but still gets banned sometimes o_O[/quote]

[quote=JEFFY40HANDS]The champs that are game changers are (IMO): Annie Ashe Galeo Fiddlesticks Karthus (under the right circumstances) Twisted Fate (not as good as he used to be but, if positioned properly his ulti still has some use, and his damage is still great) Those champs all bring something unique to the table that when used properly win games. (As long as they can be played consistently in a match. Annie has Tibbers Ashe has her arrow and her perma slow Galeo has his AoE taunt Fiddlesticks has suprisingly good survivability (Fear+Drain) and an ultimate that wrecks face Karthus has an amazing lane presence and an Ulti that scares people regardless of position on map. These champs as I said have something they can offer a team. This is not to say other champs don't bring some real benefit to the team, but these champs when played well and executed properly WILL win teamfights, or change them in their favor.[/quote]

[quote=NicknameMy][[Singed]] is also a game changer. If he is doing well at solo top, nobody can stop him and if [[singed]] is out of control, you pretty much lost. Enemys try all to stop [[singed]], so they don't get [[fling]], but that is, what [[singed]] wants.[/quote]

[quote=PsiGuard][quote=ZioSerpe] Tank- [[alistar]]-[[amumu]]-[[Leona]]: Leo and mummy are pretty much my best tanks, I actually made my team win just because I was playing them a fair share of times. While my Ali could use some improvement, sadly I dun get the guy, for some reasons I feel like I get killed way too easily. [/quote] [[Alistar]] is not a tank, that's probably why you don't get him. He's about as much a tank as [[Taric]]. Their both supports at heart, but Alistar supports more with CC while Taric has better heals. You are in bot lane right? You should be, because Ali's pretty damn good at supporting a carry. I also hope you're not building him AP after the nerfs. Honestly he works much better more often as a tanky support. Check out my guide if you're looking for a build, even my AP build is a tankier version than most. [[Amumu]] is banned quite a bit from what I hear, and [[Leona]] doesn't fit into the meta very well. Explore some more options for tank and tanky DPS roles. I also didn't see a single solo top in your list other than Udyr, who you listed as a jungler. Try out [[Malphite]], [[Irelia]], [[Cho'Gath]], [[Singed]] or [[Gragas]].[/quote]

[quote=wRAthoFVuLK][quote=JEFFY40HANDS] These champs as I said have something they can offer a team. This is not to say other champs don't bring some real benefit to the team, but these champs when played well and executed properly WILL win teamfights, or change them in their favor. [/quote] A LOT more champs than the few you mentioned can do that...most APs, especially Orianna, Brand, Gragas, and Cassi, and AP Alistar; as well as many others; tanky deeps too like Wukong and J4, etc. etc. etc.[/quote]

[quote=JEFFY40HANDS][quote=wRAthoFVuLK] [quote=JEFFY40HANDS] These champs as I said have something they can offer a team. This is not to say other champs don't bring some real benefit to the team, but these champs when played well and executed properly WILL win teamfights, or change them in their favor. [/quote] A LOT more champs than the few you mentioned can do that...most APs, especially Orianna, Brand, Gragas, and Cassi, and AP Alistar; as well as many others; tanky deeps too like Wukong and J4, etc. etc. etc. [/quote] J4 is made obsolete (in terms of control) because his ulti can be flashed out of. Sure he can deal damage, and is rather durable but his ulti is countered far too easily to be considered "game changing" Orianna is strong, but her ulti is easily avoided. As well she doesn't have an element of suprise. You see her ball coming she can only move it when command attack is off CD. (or she pulls it to her with protect) it's a strong ulti. But it isn't all that game changing when it's room for error is so high. (just my opinion). Brand? Yeah he's strong too, but his ulti relies on proximity to get it's full use. Cassi, we both know she is strong, but her ultimate range is what causes error. As well the fact that the main draw is its awesome stun. But most of the time (unless you have proper positioning) the stun is avoided and the slow is rather underwhelming when you're trying to score solid hits on multiple targets. Gragas is awesome. But once again his ulti is the main thing that makes his damage in a teamfight or an initiation on someone less appealing. I love Gragas, I really do, but compared to the reliability/insta CC of Tibbers Annie's ultimate wins out imo. I watched Shushei miss every Gragas ultimate in his game against CLG (If I remember). And the one or two he landed didn't succeed in sending an enemy into a vulnerable position. AP Alistar, yeah he's a beast even after nerfs, but without his ultimate he's a sitting duck just like any other mage. You could list off every AP champ in the game and I would agree they have some beneficial things. The list I made was meant to point out THE MOST game changing champs. They are the most game changing because they are extremely reliable, I'm not saying the other champs don't have their places but can you say Jarvan's ultimate is more game changing than Ashe's arrow? Or Tibbers is less reliable than a Gragas Exploding Cask or Orianna Ulti (1 step too far and you just ultied yourself). I can't.... So to clarify: List was meant to represent champs that I saw as being most reliable in terms of ability to change the pace of a game. (with their ultis) This is just my opinion, I'm sure it varies from person to person. Which is fine, the list I made is just my opinion.[/quote]

[quote=Metalsonic]Solo top : Yorick + Malphite AP mid : Kassadin + Le Blanc Jungler : Olaf + Nunu AD range: Sivir + Twitch Support : Kayle + Soraka Those are pretty much the current META champions and are all very strong picks to master and you likely will succeed competitively in tournament play by mastering those champions because they are proven to be tier 1 champions .[/quote]

[quote=marisi][quote=ZioSerpe] Know how to play all of them pretty well, Annie was my 1st main, WW and Shen are piece of cake, I do a pretty nice janna even tho I prefer using Soraka or Sona when I play support. As for my ashe, she might use a little improvement. [/quote] Woot, [[shen]] a piece of cake? U must be very pro.[/quote]