Fiora's Builds

[quote=Jpikachu1999]Warmog's gives more AD from Atma's, but Frozen Mallet has 20 built in AD. It ends up being 65 AD with Warmog's and 74 with Mallet. Also, his example of a tanky DPS build was this: [[Mercury's Treads]] (he didn't actually say, but I assumed) [[Frozen Mallet]] [[Atma's Impaler]] [[Guardian Angel]] [[Last Whisper]] I don't see any lifesteal in that build.[/quote]

[quote=RCIX][quote=Jpikachu1999] She has strong innate damage [/quote] She has a total of 280 guaranteed physical damage (scales with 1.2 bonus AD), another 260 magic damage (scales with 1.0 AP, but it sucks to buy ap for this) if the enemy attacks you when you use it. In the cooldown of that physical damage, skarner can deal 425 physical damage and 528 magic damage, all of it guaranteed (i.e. not dependent on the enemies taking any actions). That's ~double. [quote=Jpikachu1999] [[Mercury's Treads]] [[Wit's End]] [[Frozen Mallet]] [[Atma's Impaler]] [[Youmuu's Ghostblade]] [[Wriggle's Lantern]] Not necessarily in that order. What are you talking about they will auto attack you to death? You get about 150 or more Armor with a tanky DPS build. Plus, you can activate Youmuu's and your E and you already hit the AS cap. AP carries will have trouble bursting you down because of your MR. Also, your example of tanky DPS had no lifesteal, without lifesteal, you don't got Fiora. [/quote] By the time you get all that, your average glasscannon carry will have: [[infinity edge]] [[phantom dancer]] [[phantom dancer]] [[the bloodthirster]] [[last whisper]] and not care about your armor, just chunking you with Tons of Damage(TM). [quote=Jpikachu1999] Sure, you can mash your R with your build. Mash R on the nearest character. The tank. Also, how about the tank, let's say Shen, [[Shadow Dash]]es you and you can't do anything. From your post, I got this idea: [[Berseker's Greaves]] [[Phantom Dancer]] [[Infinity Edge]] [[The bloodthirster]] [[Frozen Mallet]] and let's say [[The black cleaver]] Basically, all the said AD carry has to do is build a [[thornmail]] so that they live your initial [[Blade Waltz]] and then you die immediately under focus fire. You could argue it's the same with the tanky DPS, but with the tanky DPS you won't die under one second of focus fire. So, you will be able to maybe get the kill. [/quote] Why the heck did you waste your [[lunge]]s not getting to their AD carry or squishy AP? In any case, you have an auto-counter to lifesteal with either a black cleaver or a [[last whisper]] (counter being arpen + lifesteal). (pretty sure shen being able to taunt you out of your ult is a bug btw) Quite simply, there are a number of requirements that one has to meet to be a tanky derps, and Fiora [b]simply can't do that.[/b] This means the smartest route is melee semi-glass-cannon carry, which unfortunately for a number of reasons is [i]very[/i] situational.[/quote]

[quote=iownedya]I agree with Jpikachu1999! [[Riposte]] already gives a bunch of passive damage. For people like [[ Nocturne]] or [[Kog'Maw]], you don't get as much attack speed as the usual glass-cannon build. With the passive of their attack speed buff at level 5, you will have approximately 1.4 attack speed. One [[Phantom Dancer]] should be enough to satisfy your needs. Plus, with the glass-cannon build, simply put ONE stun on her and she is dead. CC is deadly for anyone, so at least survive the CC and do some decent damage![/quote]

[quote=RCIX][quote=iownedya] I agree with Jpikachu1999! [[Riposte]] already gives a bunch of passive damage. For people like [[ Nocturne]] or [[Kog'Maw]], you don't get as much attack speed as the usual glass-cannon build. With the passive of their attack speed buff at level 5, you will have approximately 1.4 attack speed. One [[Phantom Dancer]] should be enough to satisfy your needs. Plus, with the glass-cannon build, simply put ONE stun on her and she is dead. CC is deadly for anyone, so at least survive the CC and do some decent damage! [/quote] I don't know how to make this any clearer. As a full tanky DPS, you don't put out as much damage as real bruisers, aren't innately as tanky, and offer no CC. As glass cannon, you bring valuable attributes (one of the highest DPS outputs in the game, fairly sticky assuming you can get kills with that highest dps output), though for other reasons it's very tough to play Fiora that way. As far as steroids go, Nocturne has a 55 AD steroid (!), Lee Sin has a 25% lifesteal/spellvamp steroid and Nasus gets 3 damage extra on his q per unit he kills with it plus 6.375% of the damage he deals per second with his ult. Quite simply, the extra 35 AD is merely a failed attempt (IMO) to make people want to level it over Q. Failed, as in it's still better to level Q; not failed as in people actually do that =/ Also, an AS steroid means you really wanna be building that up with a lot of extra damage and crit. Not going "oh cool" and then totally ignoring how to get the most use out of it.[/quote]

[quote=iownedya]Also, Nocturne has a 40%? AS steroid as well as the 55 AD steroid. Lee Sin has a shield that gives him a bunch of sustain. Nasus has his ultimate giving him bonus max health with even more damage around him. Fiora has both a damage steroid and attack speed steroid. You are using it to the fullest if you live with it for the full duration. Also, you have at least 400 damage with Trinity Force. If you kill someone, you refresh the cooldown of her E. She will live to use as many as possible. You should have other DPS people in your team. I guess we both have good arguements, huh?[/quote]

[quote=RCIX][quote=iownedya] Also, Nocturne has a 40%? AS steroid as well as the 55 AD steroid. Lee Sin has a shield that gives him a bunch of sustain. Nasus has his ultimate giving him bonus max health with even more damage around him. [/quote] Thus my point. All the bruisers have multiple [b]very strong[/b] steroids. Fiora has a passive 35 AD bonus (not a steroid; you don't do anything to turn it on and it's not temporary), and a single [i]massive[/i] AS steroid which is begging to be synergized with. [quote=iownedya] Fiora has both a damage steroid and attack speed steroid. You are using it to the fullest if you live with it for the full duration. Also, you have at least 400 damage with Trinity Force. If you kill someone, you refresh the cooldown of her E. She will live to use as many as possible. You should have other DPS people in your team. [/quote] I did the math previously in this thread, but: A trinity force gives you less damage solo and it [i]most definitely[/i] does not scale as well as AD and crit on her.[/quote]

[quote=iownedya]Still! [[Fiora]] will still have 50% chance to crit, doing 1000 per crit. The trinity force will do about 1000 as well, so whats the problem? [[Fiora]] has that AS steroid that allows her to have 2 attack speed. This will allow her to crit half the time and survivng for its full potential. You can SPAM her E while killing everyone else. You don't want to waste her E.by capping the limit. You want something else to occupy that space. More damage and sustain.[/quote]

[quote=RCIX]Trinity force scales off base AD. /thread And 2 PDs wastes something like a grand total of 10% AD. 1 doesn't waste any and gets her crit + MS. [quote=iownedya] so whats the problem? [/quote] You're depending on 2 magic damage procs for ~30-50% of your damage, so enemies can grab a negatron and laugh off a good chunk of your damage. And you don't itemize much for crit; youmuu's should be replaced lategame. And if you replace it with much of anything else that gives crit, you might as well swap out bloodrazor/wit's end and oh look a carry build, just with atmas.[/quote]