Vynertje's Support AMA and advice thread

[quote=Vynertje][quote=terrorearl]Wanna ask it, is there anyone you build [[righteous glory]] and not [[talisman of ascension]]??? Or someone you build both items on?[/quote] Trying to think of someone but I don't think so. I mean, Glory was a pretty good option before the Talisman buffs but right now pretty much every support looking for a movement speed boost can get Talisman without sacrificing meaningful stats. On the other hand, getting both means you'll heavily lack in other regards so I wouldn't do that unless you're like REALLY desperate for engage (usually your jungler can get it too). The only real support I don't automatically get Talisman on is Braum and I don't really think he benefits from Glory either.[/quote]

[quote=Teemoshy]So, back last split when I was still watching NA LCS rather than EU, Lustboy was doing this build path where he would start with a [[spellthief's edge]], build [[sightstone]] and boots, then build [[forbidden idol]] and sell the Spellthief's to finish [[talisman of ascension]]. I've been using this build on the likes of [[annie]] and [[lulu]] since then because I don't care for [[Frost Queen's claim]] but wondered if this is no longer a good idea because of the recent-ish buffs to [[ancient coin]]. What do you think, support master senpai?[/quote]

[quote=Vynertje]It's by far the best build for most mage supports right now, only exceptions being those who start coin from the start like Janna.[/quote]

[quote=Out Of Pancakes][quote=Vynertje] Trying to think of someone but I don't think so. I mean, Glory was a pretty good option before the Talisman buffs but right now pretty much every support looking for a movement speed boost can get Talisman without sacrificing meaningful stats. On the other hand, getting both means you'll heavily lack in other regards so I wouldn't do that unless you're like REALLY desperate for engage (usually your jungler can get it too). The only real support I don't automatically get Talisman on is Braum and I don't really think he benefits from Glory either.[/quote] Nautilus maybe? Or you'd get Talisman on him?[/quote]

[quote=Vynertje]Good point, Nautilus is indeed better with glory than with talisman - he just benefits too much from tanky items and not as much from CDR. Totally forgot about him.[/quote]

[quote=MungoGeri][quote=Vynertje]Good point, Nautilus is indeed better with glory than with talisman - he just benefits too much from tanky items and not as much from CDR. Totally forgot about him.[/quote] Wouldn't you use the tanky support item on all tanky supports -- e.g. [[braum]], [[nautilus]], [[leona]], [[tahm Kench]], and maybe [[thresh]]?[/quote]

[quote=Vynertje]Just quick note, I still don't regard Tahm Kench as a support as I've only seen him top. I already mentioned before that I think he has a very poor kit for a support. Braum and Nautilus have already been mentioned; those dont generally get talisman Leona can get both; purely depends on what you need. Of course, you want to start Relic Shield but often the extra movement speed on Talisman is really good going into late game - Talisman really is edging towards broken (40 sec cooldown before CDR???) Thresh will always want to get Talisman late game. You can still start Relic Shield but Talisman will still be your first (second at last) core item[/quote]

[quote=Slappiz][quote=Vynertje]It's by far the best build for most mage supports right now, only exceptions being those who start coin from the start like Janna.[/quote] Why start coin on Janna, such a useless item in lane.[/quote]

[quote=HiFromBuddha][quote=Slappiz][quote=Vynertje]It's by far the best build for most mage supports right now, only exceptions being those who start coin from the start like Janna.[/quote] Why start coin on Janna, such a useless item in lane.[/quote] Because [[Janna]]'s main appeal aside from disengage is how she can force a lane to be passive, and coin is the best starting support item to complement that play style. The only other real option is to go [[Spellthief's Edge]], but [[Janna]] doesn't particularly want to be aggroing the enemies, and would rather sit back and get a potentially higher but definitely easier amount of gold through Coin. Plus, the typical [[Spellthief's Edge]] route of just selling it becomes redundant on her since she doesn't need the extra stars for poking, nor does she particularly fancy getting gold from poking. May as well just get Coin straight up.[/quote]

[quote=Slappiz][quote=HiFromBuddha][quote=Slappiz][quote=Vynertje]It's by far the best build for most mage supports right now, only exceptions being those who start coin from the start like Janna.[/quote] Why start coin on Janna, such a useless item in lane.[/quote] Because [[Janna]]'s main appeal aside from disengage is how she can force a lane to be passive, and coin is the best starting support item to complement that play style. The only other real option is to go [[Spellthief's Edge]], but [[Janna]] doesn't particularly want to be aggroing the enemies, and would rather sit back and get a potentially higher but definitely easier amount of gold through Coin. Plus, the typical [[Spellthief's Edge]] route of just selling it becomes redundant on her since she doesn't need the extra stars for poking, nor does she particularly fancy getting gold from poking. May as well just get Coin straight up.[/quote] [[Spellthief's Edge]] all the way. If you only sit back in lane as Janna you are doing it wrong mate. Early AA's make a huge difference during the early lane phase if you play effectively. Don't underestimate the dmg you can put out in a lane with some good early offensive with your autos.[/quote]