The next Udyr changes

[quote=NicknameMy]I would generally say if you want to build him like that [[the black cleaver]] and [[the bloodthirster]] is a must. I would also say [[the black cleaver]] is most of the time superior to [[last whisper]], as it also adds flat arpen and has more AD (and HP). Also more CDR for spamming Q. And [[the brutalizer]] is a good choise for earlygame aswell. I would also think about [[maw of malmortius]] on him as this raises his AD even further. [[hexdrinker]] is a great option early against mages. Of course, if you need it, [[mercurial scimitar]] is for the MR-slot a nice choise. For boots I would get [[mercury's treads]] if they have cc-which can be countered by it and [[boots of swiftness]] in any other case. For armor, I only see [[randuin's omen]] for him, you need the HP, armor and the active. Of course, other items are situational but Randuin's is way to effective. As last item, you can build either damage or tankyness, depending onto the situation. As for AS, you got [[tiger stance]]+[[monkey's agility]], 105%. Why would you need more? Start items: [[elixir of fortitude]], [[crystalline flask]] Earlygame Options: [[vampiric scepter]], [[the brutalizer]], [[hexdrinker]], [[giant's belt]], [[b. f. sword]], [[warden's mail]], [[ninja tabi]] Boots: [[mercury's treads]], [[boots of swiftness]] Core items: [[the black cleaver]], [[the bloodthirster]] Main Armor Choise: [[randuin's omen]] Main MR Choise: [[maw of malmortius]] Situational items: [[mercurial scimitar]], [[frozen mallet]], [[runic bulwark]], [[last whisper]], [[the bloodthirster]], [[sunfire cape]][/quote]

[quote=Lugignaf]Popping in for a quick thing about BotRK. Why not build it? The AS is nice. The AD, although minimal, is nice as well. The kicker is the active on it which when combined with bear, drastically increases his kiting power and gives him a slightly better gap closer, even if he still has to run up to them.[/quote]

[quote=NicknameMy]It was said already so many times, [[Udyr]] doesn't chase people, [[Udyr]] protects the backline. So you will not hit someone for so many times, unless he really tries to go deep. Most of the time, you will apply your [[tiger stance]] proc and some hits and your carry will be save again. For that, it is rather better to have very high AD to increase his overall damage rather than having an item giving AS and a proc. The AS isn't needed because he has enough. The slow is nice, but you don't chase people, so you don't really needed. This only leaves you 40 AD and a proc, which his meh if you compare that to [[the bloodthirster]]. Especially if you look at the 3.0 and 0.6 AD ratioo.[/quote]

[quote=Embracing]Er. I meant that I would hardly even consider buying squishy items on him.[/quote]

[quote=RaNuD][quote=Vapora Dark] Wut, I wouldn't build Udyr like Talon, lmao, you misunderstand me. Talon has escapes and ways of dodging focus; all Udyr can do is charge in screaming and punch everything until he dies. If he dies fast, he ain't much use. But I do think the focus of his build should be towards being a tanky damage dealer, taking a lot of AD for his damage. BotRK barely makes you more tanky than a straight-forward BT, and BT would do way more damage due to how spammable his Q is. [/quote] Well, we almost agree. "You" wasnt really refering to [b]you[/b], Vapora Dark. Like... generic, anonymous "you"? Anyway, we agree about the difference between Talon and Udyr, and since I dont like to build straight offensive items without any utility on him, we see different paths. My builds lean towards Embracing's idea about "no squishy items", save Zephyr and BotRK. Hey, gotta try. I believe I wont have time to spam Q, especially if my items dont give anything to the team. But yes, maybe the damage output would prove me wrong, compensating for the lack of utility.[/quote]

[quote=NicknameMy]The problem is, there aren't really many items which give defensive stats + AD. [[atma's impaler]], [[doran's blade]], [[elixir of fortitude]], [[frozen mallet]], [[hexdrinker]], [[maw of malmortius]], [[mercurial scimitar]], [[the black cleaver]], [[trinity force]], [[wriggle's lantern]], [[zeke's herald]] Looks like much, but 1/2 of it is either garbage, excludes each other, build in each other or aren't really effective on [[udyr]]. Items which would be worth it: [[elixir of fortitude]](but it is just an elixir), [[frozen mallet]], [[hexdrinker]]/[[maw of malmortius]] vs [[mercurial scimitar]], [[the black cleaver]] So, 3 items and an elixir, wow. I think riot should release a new AD item with armor, as [[atma's impaler]] is just a niche pick now.[/quote]

[quote=DillButt64]why not use udyr as a split push champion? he should have good pushing power with his R and he can duel almost everyone and most top laners get teleport anyways so he could probably split push good and if things get bad he can bear away[/quote]

[quote=Vapora Dark][quote=DillButt64] and most top laners get teleport anyways [/quote] They do?[/quote]

[quote=DillButt64]why wouldnt they? it gives you a huge map presence and allows for 4-5 man ganks bot lane and you can help with dragon fights, and get back to lane faster so you dont lose out on cs, and its not like you need the extra killing power of ignite but yeah most top laners ive seen get teleport[/quote]

[quote=Jpikachu1999][quote=DillButt64] why wouldnt they? it gives you a huge map presence and allows for 4-5 man ganks bot lane and you can help with dragon fights, and get back to lane faster so you dont lose out on cs, and its not like you need the extra killing power of ignite but yeah most top laners ive seen get teleport [/quote] I mean, I'm not like Plat or anything, but I don't see a whole lot of Teleports when I play. It gives up lane presence usually, due to less kill potential. It also takes quite a bit of coordination to have it be useful for ganks/teamfights. Maybe the occasional Shen, but otherwise I don't see it too often. Also, most of the time you do need the extra killing power of Ignite. Top lane is a lane where the laners are constantly engaging and disengaging on each other. Most top laners also tend to be strong powerhouses early. Thus, Ignite helps kill faster, and it also helps reduce the effect of things like lifesteal, health regen, and health potions. You can only burst so hard and often before the enemy leaves and comes back, Ignite tends to finish the job.[/quote]