Mobafire League of Legends Build Guides Mobafire League of Legends Build Guides
's Forum Avatar

AD vs AP - A discussion about damage

Creator: BusDriver210
August 4, 2012 9:11pm
37 posts page 1 of 4 Forums » General Discussion » AD vs AP - A discussion about damage
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by BusDriver210 » August 4, 2012 9:11pm | Report
Ever since the removal of dodge I have been feeling that AD sources of damage output have been a little too strong. I don't play AP much, but I just don't see anything matching a lategame AD carry in damage. I am under the impression that they are meant to be the top damage source, but it just seems a little outrageous some matches.

Infinity Edge Phantom Dancer Last Whisper vs. Rabadon's Deathcap Rylai's Crystal Scepter Void Staff

I would really like to get your guys opinions on the two difference damage sources and which one you think is more powerful. With about 130 MR and around 3k health any bruiser can soak some AP damage, but even with the highest armor points Last Whisper just makes AD carries kill anything.

Another way to look at the argument is AOE vs single target. Carries like Karthus are kinda in a weird spot compared to most burst APs. His ability to enter a fight and deal massive damage to everyone outclasses most AP roles.

Thoughts?
+Rep me if i'm useful!
BusDriver210's Forum Avatar

Awards Showcase
Show more awards
BusDriver210
<Member>
Posts: 906
Joined: Feb 28th, 2011
Rep: Notable (46)
Blog   |   Profile
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by Phil15 » August 4, 2012 9:23pm | Report
Ap is something used to burst quickly and dont need to stay in the middle of the fight to do their dps whereas AD carries must do the maximum number of auto-attacks possible to do their damage.

Honestly I do not believe Ad carries are overpowered. Of course they do more damage in teamfights but there is a greater risk to die for them as their build do not provide them any surviability.


And a bruiser with 3k health just need to land one cc to the carry and hes pretty much dead. Moreover the only carries that will kill those bruisers quickly are hyper carries such as Vayne Kog'Maw and Tristana.


In short, I do believe Ap and Ad are balanced


You might like to post this thread there also http://www.mobafire.com/league-of-legends/forum/theorycrafting
Phil15's Forum Avatar

Awards Showcase
Show more awards
Phil15
<Member>
Posts: 510
Joined: Oct 23rd, 2010
Rep: Notable (23)
Profile
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by H4xDefender » August 4, 2012 9:30pm | Report
AD is pretty close to AP, they serve different functions. AD outclassed by AP early but outclasses them late for the most part.

Bruisers have it worse then both overall though.
H4xDefender's Forum Avatar

Awards Showcase
Show more awards
H4xDefender
<Veteran>
Posts: 2035
Joined: Nov 20th, 2011
Rep: Established (122)
Blog   |   Profile
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by wRAthoFVuLK » August 5, 2012 2:25am | Report
As said earlier, different functions; generally the AD will be stronger than the AP late game, but, on the same levels of fed, usually the AP is a bit stronger damage-wise early game. Generally it is the AP's job to burst key targets down, while the AD kills everyone and everything else. Kind of. In a nutshell. It's a bit more complicated than that but ya

Thanks to TRUeLM, Plastictree, Scrax, Xiaowiriamu, foggy12, JahGFX, jhoijhoi, msrobinson, JEFFY40HANDS, Nyoike, MissMaw, and me :) for the sigs!
wRAthoFVuLK's Forum Avatar

Awards Showcase
Show more awards
wRAthoFVuLK
<Altruistic Artist>
Posts: 10851
Joined: Jan 17th, 2011
Rep: Renowned (535)
Blog   |   Profile
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by PsiGuard » August 5, 2012 2:32am | Report

I don't play AP much, but I just don't see anything matching a lategame AD carry in damage.

This has always been true. That's how it's supposed to be. Also the AD is generally more vulnerable while dealing their damage as it's DPS, not burst. They have to stand and autoattack for several seconds while a lot of APs can unload their damage in an instant.



This isn't a fair comparison. For one, your AD build is completely focused on DPS while your AP build has rylai's, part of which is defensive and part is utility. Even accepting this matchup, chances are the AD carry would die before they got more than 2 attacks off anyway. Most APs should be able to burst a glass target when they have deathcap.
Thanks to Fatelblade for the sig!
PsiGuard's Forum Avatar

Awards Showcase
Show more awards
PsiGuard
<Community Manager>
Posts: 7866
Joined: Jun 26th, 2011
Rep: Eminent (928)
Blog   |   Profile
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by Anastasios » August 5, 2012 3:00am | Report
Let's say you have Tristana vs Ahri. If Ahri gets her Charm, she can kill tristana without taking any damage, so trist's dps is 0.
Or let's say Vayne vs Malzahar. A full Malza combo can 100-0 pretty much anyone, so vayne deals zero damage alltogether. The point of APs is to instaburst (or generally disable and kill) the ADs.

Many thanks to MissMaw, LaCorpse, Xiron, Arcana3 and Joxuu for making me sigs!
Anastasios's Forum Avatar

Anastasios
<Member>
Posts: 1027
Joined: Dec 19th, 2011
Rep: Memorable (83)
Blog   |   Profile
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by Crows foot » August 5, 2012 3:14am | Report
Thing is you can't compare ad vs ap since they don't match up against each other in simple 1v1s. They both need the cc to take the other one down.
If you for some reason want to follow my ranked journey to gold, you can do it Here.

I am against asking for rep, only rep me if you think I contributed well or said something wise.
Crows foot's Forum Avatar

Crows foot
<Member>
Posts: 1969
Joined: Jun 11th, 2011
Rep: Notable (37)
Profile
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by Luther3000 » August 5, 2012 5:11am | Report

I don't play AP much, but I just don't see anything matching a lategame AD carry in damage.


They're not supposed to.
Luther3000's Forum Avatar

Awards Showcase
Show more awards
Luther3000
<Sharpshooter>
Posts: 8046
Joined: Jun 24th, 2011
Rep: Esteemed (440)
Blog   |   Profile
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by Mooninites » August 5, 2012 6:56am | Report
AD based champions generally scale off items, while AP based champions scale more off levels. Thats why the meta is AP mid and AD bot. That's not to say that certain champions don't scale well with AP, strangely enough I believe that the best late-game scaling champion is Vladimir.

However with this said, I think AD is pretty far ahead of AP with an Infinity Edge and Zeal or better. Once an AD carry gets those two items, they will pretty much always outclass the AP champion. I think the problem is more that there's like 1 maybe 2 build paths for AD champions and multiple for AP. Infinity Edge and Phantom Dancer are core on pretty much every AD. Last Whisper or The Black Cleaver rounded out with The Bloodthirster and some defensive item.

With an AP based champion there are so many more build paths, you don't have to rush Rabadon's Deathcap first to be effective, you can go Abyssal Mask, Will of the Ancients, etc. This is probably part of the reason why you see AD outscaling AP, they need less core items to deal damage than AP does. For example sake, An AD carry with Infinity Edge and Phantom Dancer will deal leagues more damage than any AP champion with Rabadon's Deathcap and Void Staff even though they're roughly the same cost in gold.
Thanks for the Signature MissMaw!
Mooninites's Forum Avatar

Awards Showcase
Show more awards
Mooninites
<Member>
Posts: 3037
Joined: Jan 25th, 2011
Rep: Distinguished (275)
Blog   |   Profile
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep | Commend by cooper56 » August 5, 2012 7:52am | Report
Ad is over time

Ap is instant (95% of time)
cooper56's Forum Avatar

cooper56
<Member>
Posts: 1282
Joined: Sep 13th, 2011
Rep: Notable (28)
Profile

Quick Reply:

Guest commenting is currently disabled, please log in or sign up to respond!