It has always been like that jhoi.
lol.
@others, and in specific Tem,
we aren't saying that the builds are bad, and shouldn't be listened to...it is obvious they know what they are talking about, but the problem is they expect the readers to also.
They don't put in the effort that most of the user-made top rated guides do, and as such I don't think they should be able to easily surpass the user guides in search.
Think about it, if any of those guides were the SAME EXACT guides, but not made by people with yellow names, they wouldn't have a chance, basically.
What most people look for in a guide is, a guide. A lot of people that come to guides look at them since they have no clue how to play that certain champ, and I doubt they would want to read, for instance from SV's new GP guide
"Items
Gangplanks core is Wriggles+trinity+last whisper. After these three items you build will depend on what your team needs. If your team needs more dps build Infinity edge+banshee. If your team needs more tank then grab warmogs+atmas.
If the game goes super super late game you can sell your boots and buy a phantom dancer in its place."
for the whole item section, versus the top rated GP guide currently, with the following item description:
"Choice of Items
Starting Items
This will give you early crit with your Parrrley and the health potions will allow you to sustain your lane. You could switch Brawler's Gloves for if you prefer the early mobility
Later Into The Game
1.) I quickly turn it into an Avarice Blade: 12% Crit Chance and 5 Gold per 10. After that, we start building our Trinity Force.
2.) We start off making a Sheen. A Sheen will make Parrrley hit for so much more as it proc on-hit effects. After that, I get a Zeal, which gives us a little bit of speed, as we do not have out boots yet, and a nice amount of crit. By then, your opponents have probably already gotten Tier 2 boots. Which means we are a great deal slow than the opposition. So we will now get Ionian Boots of Lucidity. They give a good deal of CDR which will further take down the cooldown of Parrrley, making it absolutely spammable. NOW, we build our Trinity Force. That gives us a good bit of every thing and getting an EXTRA slow with the Phage component is extremely helpful.
3.) Now we start making our Infinity Edge. I like to start with a Cloak of Agility, it adds on to our crit nicely. Now I buy whichever part I can, first, Then i finish off my Infinity Edge with what ever item I had not bought.
4.) I like to buy an Elixir of Fortitude and a Elixir of Agility. The red elixir makes me slightly less squishy and provides 10 attack damage. The green elixir gives me some more crit.
5.) Now i build the Zeal portion of a Phantom Dancer, which makes me much faster and now i have a LARGE amount of Critical Strike Chance. I just build that into a Phantom Dancer now. By now, you are probably single-handedly tearing apart their team.
6.) So everyone is probably building some armor. Now we counter THEIR counter. Last Whisper time! You just broke through 40% of their armor. A Black Cleaver will work better than a Last Whisper if the enemies have under 112.5 armor. 113 Armor and beyond,a Last Whisper is better.
7.) End game, your have very little resistances, and you still want to hurt more. So we get an Atma's Impaler! You are probably wondering, "Gangplank has very little health, why get an item that gives AD based on how much HP you have?" Well first of all, it gives 45 armor and 18% crit. That makes your crit chance immense!
And the +45 armor cures some of your squishy-ness. Now the good part, Gangplank doesn't have much health, but that doesn't mean it is bad. With this build, Gangplank has 2203 health. That is 44.06 more AD for you, and it only costs 2355 Gold. That is 1735 Gold worth of Attack Damage and 18% Crit and on top of that it gives you 45 armor! A Zeal and and extra Brawler's Gloves is a total of 1495
gold and gives the SAME amount of crit as an Atma's. Buying an Atma's Impaler is clearly very worthwhile!
Gold Per 1 Attack Damage (This is proof of how much gold worth of AD an Atma's Gives)
I calculated how much Attack Damage is worth in gold, by taking the average of basic items from the shop, so for Attack Damage (AD):
10dmg = 415g = 41.5g per 1 AD
25dmg = 975g = 39g per 1 AD
50dmg = 1850g = 37g per 1 AD
Take the average gives you:
1 AD = 39.1666666666...g
Situational Items
Banshee's Veil This can save you from a pesky Karthus or Vladimir ult, or stopping a LeBlanc or Annie Combo in its tracks. If you are willing to sacrifice damage for survivability you can pick this up.
Cloak and Dagger If you don't have Merc Treads and you get into a lot of CC this could be slightly helpful, as it gives 20% crit and 25 Tenacity
Executioner's Calling This item, isn't really good, but it can sometimes help if there is a big healer on the other
Force of Nature If their AP carry is insanely fed and you NEED the MR i could see this helping.
Frozen Heart Same with a FoN, if there is a fed AD carry, this might work
Frozen Mallet If you can't catch up to your enemy or they keep running away, this could help you track down and kill your enemy, and give some ad (From atma's) as well
Madred's Bloodrazor This could really help you kill enemies with a large amount of hp
Mercury's Treads IF you are being heavily cced this could help you when Remove Scurvy is on CoolDown
The Bloodthirster If you are a big fan of lifesteal this oculd be a very good item for you
The Black Cleaver When the enemies have under 12.5 Armor this is a better choice than a Last Whisper
Thornmail AD champ is fed? Let's just make them take 30% of the damage they do to me!
Tiamat I am not a big fan of this item, but if the enemy team tends to clump up together having all of your items do AoE damage is pretty nice, and it makes farming a breeze
If you are buying any AP item on Gangplank, find another champion to play."
Don't you think if you were totally clueless on GP, you would want an explanation of why to get what items and what effect they have on GP, versus just "buy this then that then that then that gg"?
I don't think it is fair that these minimal effort guides get to one up the top rated ones just because of the author, honestly.
Also @Tem, I think you are overestimating how long guide writing takes T_T
My Kat guide I finished in apprx 6 or 7 hours (of course I type fast, but xD)
Most of those pro guides could be made from start to finish in 15-30 minutes, easily.
Should they one up guides with more effort that deserve the top spot, just because they are pros? I think not.
And lol I don't think ANYONE ever spend thousands or even hundreds of hours making a guide T_T
Maybe most was 50-75ish.
lol.
@others, and in specific Tem,
we aren't saying that the builds are bad, and shouldn't be listened to...it is obvious they know what they are talking about, but the problem is they expect the readers to also.
They don't put in the effort that most of the user-made top rated guides do, and as such I don't think they should be able to easily surpass the user guides in search.
Think about it, if any of those guides were the SAME EXACT guides, but not made by people with yellow names, they wouldn't have a chance, basically.
What most people look for in a guide is, a guide. A lot of people that come to guides look at them since they have no clue how to play that certain champ, and I doubt they would want to read, for instance from SV's new GP guide
"Items
Gangplanks core is Wriggles+trinity+last whisper. After these three items you build will depend on what your team needs. If your team needs more dps build Infinity edge+banshee. If your team needs more tank then grab warmogs+atmas.
If the game goes super super late game you can sell your boots and buy a phantom dancer in its place."
for the whole item section, versus the top rated GP guide currently, with the following item description:
"Choice of Items
Starting Items
This will give you early crit with your Parrrley and the health potions will allow you to sustain your lane. You could switch Brawler's Gloves for if you prefer the early mobility
Later Into The Game
1.) I quickly turn it into an Avarice Blade: 12% Crit Chance and 5 Gold per 10. After that, we start building our Trinity Force.
2.) We start off making a Sheen. A Sheen will make Parrrley hit for so much more as it proc on-hit effects. After that, I get a Zeal, which gives us a little bit of speed, as we do not have out boots yet, and a nice amount of crit. By then, your opponents have probably already gotten Tier 2 boots. Which means we are a great deal slow than the opposition. So we will now get Ionian Boots of Lucidity. They give a good deal of CDR which will further take down the cooldown of Parrrley, making it absolutely spammable. NOW, we build our Trinity Force. That gives us a good bit of every thing and getting an EXTRA slow with the Phage component is extremely helpful.
3.) Now we start making our Infinity Edge. I like to start with a Cloak of Agility, it adds on to our crit nicely. Now I buy whichever part I can, first, Then i finish off my Infinity Edge with what ever item I had not bought.
4.) I like to buy an Elixir of Fortitude and a Elixir of Agility. The red elixir makes me slightly less squishy and provides 10 attack damage. The green elixir gives me some more crit.
5.) Now i build the Zeal portion of a Phantom Dancer, which makes me much faster and now i have a LARGE amount of Critical Strike Chance. I just build that into a Phantom Dancer now. By now, you are probably single-handedly tearing apart their team.
6.) So everyone is probably building some armor. Now we counter THEIR counter. Last Whisper time! You just broke through 40% of their armor. A Black Cleaver will work better than a Last Whisper if the enemies have under 112.5 armor. 113 Armor and beyond,a Last Whisper is better.
7.) End game, your have very little resistances, and you still want to hurt more. So we get an Atma's Impaler! You are probably wondering, "Gangplank has very little health, why get an item that gives AD based on how much HP you have?" Well first of all, it gives 45 armor and 18% crit. That makes your crit chance immense!
And the +45 armor cures some of your squishy-ness. Now the good part, Gangplank doesn't have much health, but that doesn't mean it is bad. With this build, Gangplank has 2203 health. That is 44.06 more AD for you, and it only costs 2355 Gold. That is 1735 Gold worth of Attack Damage and 18% Crit and on top of that it gives you 45 armor! A Zeal and and extra Brawler's Gloves is a total of 1495
gold and gives the SAME amount of crit as an Atma's. Buying an Atma's Impaler is clearly very worthwhile!
Gold Per 1 Attack Damage (This is proof of how much gold worth of AD an Atma's Gives)
I calculated how much Attack Damage is worth in gold, by taking the average of basic items from the shop, so for Attack Damage (AD):
10dmg = 415g = 41.5g per 1 AD
25dmg = 975g = 39g per 1 AD
50dmg = 1850g = 37g per 1 AD
Take the average gives you:
1 AD = 39.1666666666...g
Situational Items
Banshee's Veil This can save you from a pesky Karthus or Vladimir ult, or stopping a LeBlanc or Annie Combo in its tracks. If you are willing to sacrifice damage for survivability you can pick this up.
Cloak and Dagger If you don't have Merc Treads and you get into a lot of CC this could be slightly helpful, as it gives 20% crit and 25 Tenacity
Executioner's Calling This item, isn't really good, but it can sometimes help if there is a big healer on the other
Force of Nature If their AP carry is insanely fed and you NEED the MR i could see this helping.
Frozen Heart Same with a FoN, if there is a fed AD carry, this might work
Frozen Mallet If you can't catch up to your enemy or they keep running away, this could help you track down and kill your enemy, and give some ad (From atma's) as well
Madred's Bloodrazor This could really help you kill enemies with a large amount of hp
Mercury's Treads IF you are being heavily cced this could help you when Remove Scurvy is on CoolDown
The Bloodthirster If you are a big fan of lifesteal this oculd be a very good item for you
The Black Cleaver When the enemies have under 12.5 Armor this is a better choice than a Last Whisper
Thornmail AD champ is fed? Let's just make them take 30% of the damage they do to me!
Tiamat I am not a big fan of this item, but if the enemy team tends to clump up together having all of your items do AoE damage is pretty nice, and it makes farming a breeze
If you are buying any AP item on Gangplank, find another champion to play."
Don't you think if you were totally clueless on GP, you would want an explanation of why to get what items and what effect they have on GP, versus just "buy this then that then that then that gg"?
I don't think it is fair that these minimal effort guides get to one up the top rated ones just because of the author, honestly.
Also @Tem, I think you are overestimating how long guide writing takes T_T
My Kat guide I finished in apprx 6 or 7 hours (of course I type fast, but xD)
Most of those pro guides could be made from start to finish in 15-30 minutes, easily.
Should they one up guides with more effort that deserve the top spot, just because they are pros? I think not.
And lol I don't think ANYONE ever spend thousands or even hundreds of hours making a guide T_T
Maybe most was 50-75ish.
Thanks to TRUeLM, Plastictree, Scrax, Xiaowiriamu, foggy12, JahGFX, jhoijhoi, msrobinson, JEFFY40HANDS, Nyoike, MissMaw, and me :) for the sigs!
Dotter
<Member>
<Member>
Well said Wrath, those were my exact thoughts on this ^^
My guide for beginners took me 10-15 hours and is by far the longest guide I've made, so it is to exaggerate a bit to say hundreds of hours, though I don't think Tem actually meant it literally :p
My guide for beginners took me 10-15 hours and is by far the longest guide I've made, so it is to exaggerate a bit to say hundreds of hours, though I don't think Tem actually meant it literally :p
I think they should just be taken off the main page. Everytime I check new posts all I see is another **** quality Pro Guide. Either that or take off the guide part and put them in a section called builds, cause really that's what they are.
Their builds are good but not friendly to someone who has never played the champion before. They don't really explain much, like for example why Triforce on GP is better then Bloodthirster or why BT is better then Triforce etc, or why Triforce, Wriggle's, LW is core but Wriggle's, IE, Triforce isn't, etc etc etc.
Whereas the current top rated guide at least explains a bit more.
Just saiyan, I really don't have a huge opinion except to say I love the builds but not the guides for the most part lol.
Their builds are good but not friendly to someone who has never played the champion before. They don't really explain much, like for example why Triforce on GP is better then Bloodthirster or why BT is better then Triforce etc, or why Triforce, Wriggle's, LW is core but Wriggle's, IE, Triforce isn't, etc etc etc.
Whereas the current top rated guide at least explains a bit more.
Just saiyan, I really don't have a huge opinion except to say I love the builds but not the guides for the most part lol.
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____â”â”____â”â”—|:::::|｡◕‿‿ÂÂÂÂ◕｡|
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Fear the power of the Nyan!
Canoas
<Member>
<Member>
Sinjustice wrote:
I feel like I'm the only one outraged by this. Why does nobody else seem to care? These "Pro" guides are a negative influence on MOBAfire, not to mention half the Pros themselves are just, for lack of a better word, ****s, flaunting their in-game credentials like it makes them good at guides and we should treat their **** like ice cream.
I raged for about 4-5 pages on the nidalee guide, but who am I to go against mods and vets? Even people who always defended that a good guide must have good and detailed explanations give vet recs to extremely aweful guides, which are worse than most guides at 60%, just because they were made by pros. It's not worth to waste your time when both the users and the staff up-vote and recommend bad guides instead of good ones. This website will never be a source of good guides thanks to this attitude, so don't bother trying to change it. Solomid ftw.
wRAthoFVuLK wrote:
This is actually being discussed in the vet forums right now, and something will be done.
Thanks to TRUeLM, Plastictree, Scrax, Xiaowiriamu, foggy12, JahGFX, jhoijhoi, msrobinson, JEFFY40HANDS, Nyoike, MissMaw, and me :) for the sigs!
wRAthoFVuLK wrote:
I see what you did there.
If you like one of my guides or a comment of mine, toss me a +Rep. Please and thank you!
PM me if you have any questions or suggestions.
jhoijhoi wrote:
I don't believe the authorities are going to completely separate the guides. Just remove them from the top 10.
Wooop.
Here we go, it has already been half-implemented.
Here's what I meant.
Here we see Hotshot's Nidalee guide listed as "Pro", then the Vet Recommendations, then the following high scoring guides.
Bryun wrote:
That is if we even get a type of "Top Champion List" on the main page like how the "Pro Guides" are. But by doing that, you would need a lot of space which we don't have and would clutter the main page to fit every champion. That's what the champion selection thing is for.
I just think if you don't allow the "Pro Guides" to be voted on and give them a sort of seperate section on the champion selection thing (Like how the recommended guides are up on top) we'd have less rage and the members guides will be fine with the votes.
I still believe people will just go to the Pro's guides more because it's just that everyone is shallow these days.
Exactly what I meant!
Temzilla wrote:
It's funny, the only people taking this well are Jhoijhoi
What? I'm all for the their guides. I have no problem with them..
EDIT: Had to re-edit......... Cause something was up with my computer.
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Wooop.
Here we go, it has already been half-implemented.
Here's what I meant.
Here we see Hotshot's Nidalee guide listed as "Pro", then the Vet Recommendations, then the following high scoring guides.