MungoGeri wrote:
By the way, I just realized why 
Zeke's Harbinger procs so often for me with Janna. Pressing Q to start priming the tornado and pressing Q to release it is considered two separate spell casts by Zeke's Harbinger. So, if I anticipate a fight coming up, a couple of fast tornadoes and a shield or two are all that are needed to get into the 80+ range where the proc will be ready to trigger when the fight starts.
Zeke's Harbinger procs so often for me with Janna. Pressing Q to start priming the tornado and pressing Q to release it is considered two separate spell casts by Zeke's Harbinger. So, if I anticipate a fight coming up, a couple of fast tornadoes and a shield or two are all that are needed to get into the 80+ range where the proc will be ready to trigger when the fight starts.I think
Ardent Censer is the go-for item on Janna though :p
MungoGeri wrote:
By the way, I just realized why Zeke's Harbinger procs so often for me with Janna. Pressing Q to start priming the tornado and pressing Q to release it is considered two separate spell casts by Zeke's Harbinger. So, if I anticipate a fight coming up, a couple of fast tornadoes and a shield or two are all that are needed to get into the 80+ range where the proc will be ready to trigger when the fight starts.
Zeke's Harbinger procs so often for me with Janna. Pressing Q to start priming the tornado and pressing Q to release it is considered two separate spell casts by Zeke's Harbinger. So, if I anticipate a fight coming up, a couple of fast tornadoes and a shield or two are all that are needed to get into the 80+ range where the proc will be ready to trigger when the fight starts.Regardless of that, it's still too unreliable. It's way too easy to proc it at the wrong moment.
Janitsu wrote:
Censer really is a ****ty item if you get it after the first 25 minutes. Before the first 25 minutes, there are more important items to get. E.g. Talisman, Mikaels, Locket, Mejais.
Vynertje wrote:
Regardless of that, it's still too unreliable. It's way too easy to proc it at the wrong moment.
I'm sorry, Vynertje, but you're saying this based off of one game, when the item was new to you. I'm telling you that in my experiences in many games, this has not been a problem. If you want to argue that the base stats on the item aren't good enough or that other items are more important to you, then more power to you. However, the proc being "unreliable" is not a valid reason not to get it. Since the charges build up based on *both* players' actions, the proc occurs quite often. And if you as a support pay attention to the charges, you can intentionally help prime the charges up to a high number on a regular basis.
There is funny fact... Its not as hard to proc it again in few moments, so its not terribly bad when you proc it too early. That item is strong and stacks being hard to control is not fact not to build it. Its like if you said that about echo, or static shiff... Try it more as both me and our team support find it very strong atm.
MungoGeri wrote:
I'm sorry, Vynertje, but you're saying this based off of one game, when the item was new to you. I'm telling you that in my experiences in many games, this has not been a problem. If you want to argue that the base stats on the item aren't good enough or that other items are more important to you, then more power to you. However, the proc being "unreliable" is not a valid reason not to get it. Since the charges build up based on *both* players' actions, the proc occurs quite often. And if you as a support pay attention to the charges, you can intentionally help prime the charges up to a high number on a regular basis.
terrorearl wrote:
There is funny fact... Its not as hard to proc it again in few moments, so its not terribly bad when you proc it too early. That item is strong and stacks being hard to control is not fact not to build it. Its like if you said that about echo, or static shiff... Try it more as both me and our team support find it very strong atm.
Then what if I tell you that I'm basing this on:
1) Theorycrafting
2) Some experience with the item to see if my theorycrafting would actually be correct
3) Checking my experience with the experience of pro players.
The conclusion I drew is the following:
1) The item has potential, but is not a MUST buy due to a number of reasons. Some reasons have to do with the item itself, some reasons have to do with the other available items
2) To expand on the latter, there are support items that often turn out far more valuable. Think the likes of
Aegis of the Legion versus multiple AP champs, Mikael's Blessing vs single target hard CC, talisman of ascension in pretty much every game, Banner of Command for sieging etc. That means you'll usually have to finish 2 core items first before the item even becomes a consideration.3) The item is very mediocre early game as crit isn't a valuable stat. So you either have to get it late game or not at all. It's not advisable to build around the item because that'd force you to build it earlier.
4) I feel like there still are some issues with the item itself. E.g. when you're taking baron and/or in quick teamfights it may still be hard to proc it when you need it. Compare it to a gnar rage bar; you CAN time it, but it's not 100% reliable regardless.
OTGBionicArm wrote:
I don't know if it's been asked, but Vyn. What are your honest thoughts on Tahm Kench?
Tahm Kench?No clue. Havent played with or against him. I've always thought he was useless as support though
Vynertje wrote:
No clue. Havent played with or against him. I've always thought he was useless as support though
I've played about 7 or so games with him, but through these short amount of games, I can tell you that Tahm's real strength is in lane phase. He can just completely deny trades or harass with
Devour, which leads to a relatively safe lane phase. In fact, I've even denied ganks with Devour.His poke is... Alright. Devouring a minion actually provides really good poke since the thrown minion has a fairly high base damage, especially at earlier levels, but the mana cost is pretty hard to work with. Not to mention the fact that using
Devour to poke creates a very wide frame of opportunity for the enemy to engage. His Q ( Tongue Lash? It's name escapes me...) is very average poke, in fact, I'd say below average. Its damage is very mediocre, and the thing that caught me off the first time around is that it stops on the first unit hit. It's a very fast projectile though, so if you line it up, it'll hit. Best thing about it is the cool down and mark application. I don't find myself using the stun that often and just end up using Devour, but I really should be to be honest since using the stun doesn't consume stacks of An Acquired Taste. Thick Skin is really good. It probably is one of the best defensive abilities in the game, no doubt. It makes you so ****ing tanky, and almost gives you another life bar to work with. The heal is definitely underwhelming at earlier levels, but for the sake of balance, thank god it is.The thing I'm not too fond of for Tahm Kizzle is the ultimate. It definitely feels pretty hard to work with in solo queue. Also, I think they went a bit overboard with the warnings for enemies. As far as I know, you can't teleport out of sight for enemies to deny the warning sounds or anything like that. Not to mention the distance for the warning is huge, two screens away or something if I remember, it's pretty ridiculous. The fact that they made the sound specific to the area around Tahm means that any enemy that hears a sound just runs away to safety. At least having a global sound like Rek'Sai or Nocturne actually still has a major impact on all lanes. I'm really trying to diagnose my issue with these ability... But I think the main thing is that it's just a boring ability with very predictable uses.
Now, game stage-wise, I've already said that he's very strong early game. He alone can create very safe lanes. I've also noticed that he works as a really good pick against certain hard engage or pick champions.
Devour can be used when your ally is under the effects of CC, so it nullifies things like Death Sentence or Dark Binding. He also renders Leona fairly useless in lane. Also, he himself has very good roaming potential. I often do pop in mid if I see an opportunity, and it's benefited almost every time. Just be careful in leaving your ADC alone. When teamfights start, let's just say I've singlehanded won and lost fights with Tahm. Devour is a very risky ability. Also doesn't help that there is actually a bug that occasionally causes Tahm to have to hold a unit for the whole duration and not be able to re activate it. A few times I've held an ally for way too long because of this, so it's lost us fights. The other main thing is the lack of engage/pick potential from Tahm alone. The only way Tahm is going to aid in a pick or an engage is through his ult with another ally in there, because his CC requires you to be in extended trades, meaning the pick potential isn't as reliable or swift as a Blitzcrank or something.This one is more of a peave if anything, but using his ult puts
Devour on a short cooldown if an ally joins in the ride. Applying real life logic to it, it makes sense since you technically are Devouring an ally, but it completely removes any aspect of clutch save with the ultimate. Pretty odd.**** that was messy.
Wanna ask it, is there anyone you build Turbo Chemtank and not talisman of ascension??? Or someone you build both items on?
Turbo Chemtank and not talisman of ascension??? Or someone you build both items on?
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