Legit Ashe Sup

[quote=FantasySniper]I thought I would attempt to give her a build that let's her enact a more supportive role, like all of the "AP carry supports" you see now. Tell me what you think, and basically how to optimize it. [color=#ff0000](Not In-Game Viability as a support)[/color] Masteries: None in Offense ([[Expose Weakness]] procs w/ only W and R), 21 in Utility mandatory, probably spend the rest of the points to get [[Oppression]] or all in Utility. Runes: AD quints, maybe some mana regen gylphs, armor seals, AS marks to help with procing or AD marks. Items: Core; [[Berserker's Greaves]], [[Frost Queen's Claim]], [[Manamune]], [[Executioner's Calling]]; Offensive; [[Zeke's Herald]], [[Trinity Force]], [[Black Cleaver]]; Defensive; [[Frozen Heart]], [[Wit's End]] Get [[Tear of the Goddess]] early. FQC takes advantage of your huge poke range and some CDR, Manamune gives you infinite mana to spam and later on a boost in damage, EC gives free crit chance for your passive and grants an amazing counter to all heals. After that everything you get is situational. ZH gives very useful stats and in an aura, TF gives huge boosts to your damage and takes advantage of the low CD of a late-game [[Volley]], TBC removes armor from an enemy, increasing everyone's damage whilst supplying some CDR. FH is useful if you lost in lane and still grants some small AD because of Manamune's passive, WE gives MR and still gives some damage help.[/quote]

[quote=luizdeh]Why [[frost queen's claim]]? For theme? Otherwise forget it. [[sightstone]] is not a situational item. GP10 runes are shit on her, she needs poke. Go AD reds, Armor yellows, MR/Mana5 glyphs, AD quints. [[ashe]] needs a bit too much to be a good support, only the slows are not gonna cut it. She needs enough mana to spam and CDR to spam more. [[talisman of ascension]] to either engage or disengage because ultimate won't be available all the time, plus the gp10 and CDR. A [[mikael's crucible]] would be a good idea as well, but not a must-have I think. The [[executioner's calling]] is actually a good idea that greatly increases her value, especially against sustain-heavy assholes. This way her every AA is a slow, applies grievous wounds and can crit. Masteries are fine, but I don't think 21 utility is mandatory, although very appealing. More damage can be good as well. Need to test this out because she's a squishy mofo. Combine her with burst carries or mobile dudes that can get on peoples face after a stun. ALL THAT BEING SAID, she still gets too easily caught by gap-closers, so I'd run her against teams that don't have many dudes that can just jump on her, which is pretty rare nowadays. As a for fun support, go for it.[/quote]

[quote=Darcurse]They should add a slow on her Volley and replace her Frost Arrows with something useful.[/quote]

[quote=FantasySniper][quote=Darcurse] They should add a slow on her Volley and replace her Frost Arrows with something useful. [/quote] [[Volley]] slows equivalent to [[Frost Shot]]'s slow. Or if that's not what you meant, I don't think removing her iconic skill will be beneficial... They should add free magic damage like [[Varus]], at least giving you a better reason to turn it on.[/quote]

[quote=Darcurse]Dunno what was not to understand there. Add Frost Shot into Volley and give her something useful as Q. While she can perma slow someone she therefore turns into a bad excuse of a damage dealer, but adding extra damage on her WHILE keeping the perma slow would be ridiculous in it's own way. She is simply outdated. Her kit has some fun components but it doesn't interwine in any way except for the scout being able to reveal your target in order to ult it (DOES anyone need this?) She can slow her target to chase it down, but that doesn't work if the enemy simply kills you with superior fire power. Take that Ult for example: Becoming more effective the further you're away on a global level is not effective in any way (Not to mention the risk of missing). Her Volley is wide range, but doesn't penetrate, and it's slow needs another skill to be leveled. In lane you can simply use your minions as shield. Plus her Scout is replaced by decent warding, basic map awareness and the new trinket... If you want do it the right way she'd need a major rework.[/quote]

[quote=FantasySniper][quote=Darcurse] She is simply outdated. If you want do it the right way she'd need a major rework. [/quote] I completely agree, but please still help me with my build. [spoiler][quote=FantasySniper] She has no escape, and her kiting only works when she's dueling. [[Focus]] is pretty weak, only giving (small) extra damage for initiations and nothing else. You have to build her correctly to get any real use out of it. (Compared to [[Headshot]], which is rewarded for not stopping the attacks.) [[Hawkshot]] seems like it would see more efficient use in higher ranks, but its CD and relatively low range makes it only useful for revealing brush when kiting. 3/4 of her skills apply CC, but she gives up some damage for this. Her ulti is global, but really hard to time and use effectively, whereas using something like [[Super Mega Death Rocket!]] gives insane damage, even [[Chain of Corruption]] is better because its effectiveness is not affected by your distance from the battle, and can immobilize more than one target. Her role is too spread out between support and ADC to deal any real damage as a carry, so basically she just doesn't fit the meta. Most everyone would choose another champion, I'm afraid. [/quote][/spoiler][/quote]

[quote=EdisonKhoo]Same, max [[volley]] first like ADC [[ashe]], [[frost arrow]] second, [[hawkshot]] last and max [[enchanted crystal arrow]] at lvl 6, 11, 16. [[spellthief's edge]], don't [[ancient coin]] alr :p Spellthief's gets a buff and coin gets a nerf alr =/ You can buy talisman at late game if you really need to. Starting Items would be either 1. [[spellthief's edge]], x1 [[stealth ward]] and x2 [[health potion]] with a [[warding totem]] or 2. [[doran's shield]] and x2 [[health potion]] with a [[warding totem]]. Swith the totem to [[sweeping lens]] if you get [[sightstone]]. Her masteries could either be 0/14/16 or 0/9/21, maybe 9/0/21 too. AD or Hybrid pen marks, armour seals, MR or Scaling MR glyphs, AD or Health Quints. Good Luck on your guide ^^[/quote]

[quote=TheKut][quote=FantasySniper] I thought I would attempt to give her a build that let's her enact a more supportive role, like all of the "AP carry supports" you see now. Tell me what you think, and basically how to optimize it. [color=#ff0000](Not In-Game Viability as a support)[/color] Masteries: None in Offense ([[Expose Weakness]] procs w/ only W and R), 21 in Utility mandatory, probably spend the rest of the points to get [[Oppression]] or all in Utility. Runes: AD quints, maybe some mana regen gylphs, armor seals, AS marks to help with procing or AD marks. Items: Core; [[Talisman of Ascension]], [[Manamune]], [[Executioner's Calling]], [[Zeke's Herald]], [[Sightstone]] Get [[Avarice Blade]] and [[Tear of the Goddess]] early. ToA let's you not steal from the ADC's CS, Manamune gives you infinite mana to spam, EC gives free crit chance for your passive and grants an amazing counter to all heals, ZH gives you a useful aura effect that no one will complain about, Sightstone grants free wards so you won't have to waste your [[Hawkshot]]. Her boots could be either [[Berserker's Greaves]] or [[Boots of Mobility]] With max CDR from ZH and ToA, getting any more will be a waste. [/quote] Seems like fun, I will probably try this with a friend later today. Edit: I'll try it again when I get an adc that actually can last hit...[/quote]

[quote=FantasySniper]So I updated the build, any thoughts?[/quote]

[quote=The_Nameless_Bard]should build Ashe fairly similar to any other support with a few exceptions, she basically becomes a utility based support rather than a damage dealing one. [[manamune]] and [[trinity force]] are way too expensive to justify buying for what you'll get out of them. [[the black cleaver]] might be justified if you're really fed, but scrap the others. Unlike AP supports, whose ability to support is often increased by buying offense items, you really don't need damage to do your job. [[ionian boots of lucidity]] > [[berserker's greaves]] because [[volley]] spam is your main form of harass. buy [[spellthief's edge]]/[[frostfang]] if you want, but get [[talisman of ascension]] late game because [[frost queen's claim]] is utterly redundant. [[mikael's crucible]]/[[sightstone]] are core on any support. early chalice will allow you to spam, upgrade to [[ruby sightstone]] when you have a full build [[executioner's calling]] and [[zeke's Herald]] are ok, but certainly not core [[wit's end]] isn't really worth having [[randuin's omen]] > [[frozen heart]] in most situations runes and masteries: MS/flat hp quints, AD marks, armor seals, mr glyphs 9-21-0 or 0-13-17, full utility tree isn't really worth it on Ashe imo. She's super squishy and needs a decent amount of defense or you'll just get bursted.[/quote]