Brusier top, why I should skill defense, not...

[quote=DuffTime][quote=Luther3000] I'm loath to disagree with him, because if I do it'll probably become OP in two or three months time. [/quote] Lol. Well Cho is super versatile and works with soooo many items. The reason he can use AD is Vorpal spikes, and the simple fact that he scales well with AS. Meaning both on hit and AD type items are viable. Atma's is only a really strong item when coupled with a green pot on Cho, but then it's just like... TOO COST EFFICIENT. Stupidly efficient. Also + Zeal into Trinity Force and suddenly you're chunking things. It sorta depends on where I am on the map however, in regards to what I'll build. When I jungle I tend to build a lot more attack speed and when I solo top I tend to build tankier. Jungle build could be~ Merc Tread's, Wit's end, GA (This is my standard starting 3 items every game as jungle Cho no matter what :P) and from here build Warmogg's and Trinity Force and Finish with Madred's. Solo top is really hard to determine but vrs AD it's almost always Merc or Tabi, Glacial Shroud and Frozen heart, Negatron Cloak, and from here I'll diversify my builds. When I solo top I generally buy the Zeal at this point, sometimes finish FoN here, (Move speed so gud) sometimes I will rush the Trinity, sometimes build Atma's after Zeal, sometimes Warmogg's comes here. Sometimes GA? My solo top builds vary WIDELY as I play the main tank role (Cho is a special champion in that even using offtank gear he can full tank thanks to HP passive and DPS steroid on E.) but do sneak some offense in as well.[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime][quote=Searz] Seriously tho, just take a look at the math and you'll see how bad it is. [/quote] Yes well mathematically there are superior returns for investments on looots of things in this game. You could be getting better bang for your buck in other areas potentially but that doesn't invalidate the selection of wealth and greed on supports. I can only keep using the armor reds and blues analogy. I use 100% armor pages against champions like Riven and Renekton and Garen, and it essentially removes them as a threat from the game. (They generally have to stomp lanes or they can't make a deep impact.) In this instance, Armor blues have a higher impact on the outcome of the game than MR blues will, even though they are less efficient. So yes while the math may incline that other alternatives are superior in this instance, Wealth is still a strong choice on supports ^_^[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime][quote=Feredues] Why is anyone considering Atma's as an item on Cho'Gath in regards to anything but the bonus armor? Are we really thinkin' AD ChoCho..? Nuuu.. T-T I've played him as tank, I've trolled as Cho AP carry, but even with Vorpal, I've never seen that as viable. [/quote] I'd be glad to do a custom game or two and show you how it works ^_^[/quote]

[quote=Embracing]Tanky Deeps Cho is viable. Cho can go: 1) Full on CDR Tank focusing on disruptions 2) AP / Tank which is focused on being tanky and doing nukes (less tanky, personally dislike) 3) AD / Tank which is focused on on-hit anti-carrying / disruptions while also being really tanky. Basically just an offtank. I like the 3rd one (Duff's build) because it works SO well in this metagame. Warmog's on Tanky DPS cho is just like RoA on AP / Tank cho, except better because it synergizes with Atma's and his ult SO WELL. And back on topic: The defense tree is strong. REALLY strong for bruisers. Most bruisers don't even spec into utility now. It's all XX/XX/0. And let me ask you this. What bruiser needs critical strike and crit dmg? Only the crit-based ones. IMO only if you have a crit-ish build you should spec in 21/9/0. By crit-ish I mean Youmuu's + Atma's + Inf Edge[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime][quote=RosePhoenix] I like the 3rd one (Duff's build) because it works SO well in this metagame. [/quote] It's actually not very related to the meta tbh :P His sustain makes him a natural boss in all lanes, he can go anywhere and he's one of the pound for pound greats in the jungle. If you do want a tanky ass beast who can still be a threat as a right clicker however, Cho is your man. The fact that his skills have great effects without building into them like silences and slows/pop ups, is just the icing on the cake. Built in HP, yada yada, he's a bawse ^_^ He DOES fit the meta very well, but it's not why you should build these items is my point. These items would be the best choices regardless of the meta for Chogie ^_^[/quote]

[quote=Embracing][quote=DuffTime] It's actually not very related to the meta tbh :P His sustain makes him a natural boss in all lanes, he can go anywhere and he's one of the pound for pound greats in the jungle. If you do want a tanky ass beast who can still be a threat as a right clicker however, Cho is your man. The fact that his skills have great effects without building into them like silences and slows/pop ups, is just the icing on the cake. Built in HP, yada yada, he's a bawse ^_^ He DOES fit the meta very well, but it's not why you should build these items is my point. These items would be the best choices regardless of the meta for Chogie ^_^ [/quote] o_o Tanky DPS bruiser Cho on top is kinda related to ze meta...[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime]What is unrelated to the meta is that these items would be the best choice no matter what the meta was. ^__^ You aren't building this to handily fit the meta, you're building it because it's the best way to build Cho.[/quote]

[quote=NicknameMy]@DuffTime You should write a guide about AS/AD-cho. Because I see nothing of this build at all top guides, the top guide is AP cho. And then you can write when to get which item at which slot and which stage in the game. Should lead you to the number 1 guide pretty fast.^^ BTW: Is [[atma's impaler]]+[[trinity force]]+[[Elixir of Agility]] not a crit-build?[/quote]

[quote=PsiGuard]It's not a crit build unless it has [[Infinity Edge]]. :P[/quote]

[quote=NicknameMy]Well, even without [[infinity edge]], crits will deal 210% of the dmg. If you think about that with warmog's on cho, well^^[/quote]