Singed OP?

[quote=NicknameMy][[Force of Nature]]+[[Quicksilver Sash]] You failed.[/quote]

[quote=Trojan995]If singed didn't have such powerful stat->stat conversion he'd be fine, maybe even UP. However, just a single [[catalyst]] gives him so much survivability it's insane.[/quote]

[quote=Mazuran][quote=NicknameMy] [[Force of Nature]]+[[Quicksilver Sash]] You failed. [/quote] That's a pretty hard counter to any CC/Nuke combo, never mind Malz and DFG. DFG is, well, a big damn nuke and I said Malz cuz of how Null Zone scales with enemies health.[/quote]

[quote=theBMB]I think singed is the only champion who can charge into a group of 5 people AND baron and make it out alive. The main problem with singed is that his whole kit is dependent on him surviving. All of his damage comes from his poison and the occasionally fling. To use his poison he has to run around like a troll. To run around like a troll long enough to make a difference he has to be able to survive. And this is in context of a teamfight, this means that in any 1v1, 1v2, or even 1v3 situation singed is essentially unkillable. Ridiculous survivability and movement speed, combined with the ability to pull someone greatly out of position is just too strong. However, if they tried to hit his survivability he will just become extremely underwhelming outside of incredibly small tweaks to his passive.[/quote]

[quote=JunSupport][quote=Searz] Best way to deal with Singed is through nuking. Kind of the only way too, lol.[/quote] Why do you keep posting without doing your homework? Singed is countered by floor-based AoE slows. Nuking works on everyone, and even then, Singed can endure it quite well with [[Insanity Potion]] + [[Force of Nature]]. [quote=Trojan995] If singed didn't have such powerful stat->stat conversion he'd be fine, maybe even UP. However, just a single [[catalyst]] gives him so much survivability it's insane. [/quote] Actually, [[Empowered Bulwark]] is the only reason Singed is a tank. He was originally intended to be a fighter champion similar to Blitzcrank, who just rushes around the field, dealing damage and causing chaos. That passive is what lets him be a tank. [[Fling]] is a good initiate, but plenty of champions have powerful initiation skills and don't necessarily have what it takes to be a true tank. That's why [[Singed]] has the fighter tag, but lacks the "tank" tag currently. [quote=theBMB] I think singed is the only champion who can charge into a group of 5 people AND baron and make it out alive.[/quote] 4 people. Watch the video again.[/quote]

[quote=theBMB]^pardon me[/quote]

[quote=Searz][quote=JunSupport] [quote=Searz] Best way to deal with Singed is through nuking. Kind of the only way too, lol.[/quote] Why do you keep posting without doing your homework? Singed is countered by floor-based AoE slows. Nuking works on everyone, and even then, Singed can endure it quite well with [[Insanity Potion]] + [[Force of Nature]].[/quote] Meh, I was tired. I sometimes say weird stuff when tired. But isn't the only "floor based slow" Singed's W?[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime]Kogmaw puke is also floor based.[/quote]

[quote=DuffTime][quote=JunSupport] Actually, [[Empowered Bulwark]] is the only reason Singed is a tank. He was originally intended to be a fighter champion similar to Blitzcrank, who just rushes around the field, dealing damage and causing chaos. That passive is what lets him be a tank. [[Fling]] is a good initiate, but plenty of champions have powerful initiation skills and don't necessarily have what it takes to be a true tank. alive. [/quote] Oops, you fell into the noob trap. GG. Why do you always post thing without doing your homework? --- Rylai's is the only thing that allows him to be a tank. Your AoE ground poop isn't enough CC. Fling is a great multi-faceted skill, with tons of applications; peel, initiate, disable, interrupt, etc. But, none of that is enough to really effectively "Tank" as a champion. To "Tank" is to both initiate and protect your team. Rylai's will be the factor that provides enough CC to enable you to truely, "Tank" and the only way. You can become invincible without Rylai's, win teamfights, etc. But without Rylai's, I barely call Singed a tank. Even if he could stand under the base turret for 10 seconds. You're simply lacking in CC. It's the same reason that Morde's not a good "Tank" champion, and that Mundo's not a good "Tank" champion. Conversely, it's why Cho Gath IS a good tank, and why Galio and Amumu are as well. Lots of CC's. Granted, Singed has 2 great CC's, but to add Rylai's is what makes him a really great tank with tons of CC. --- Next point, Singed's passive is a noob trap. It's not that great. Even a fully maxed Archangel's will only give 350 HP RoA's the most applicable use of the passive and it only offers 181 bonus HP. THE ONLY reason this item is even good on him is because it allows him to leave his poison on, and the HP bonus that RoA already has. The passive slightly increases the benefit of the purchase by 181 HP. By that logic Jax is only a good fighter because his passive gives him HP. It would be to ignore the AS on his ult, and the dodge, and the AoE stuns. Singed truthfully doesn't get that much out of his passive. If you build both RoA and Frozen heart, you're getting a total of 306 HP. That's negligible. Whereas his ult gives him MASSIVE boosts to his Armor, MR, Move speed, HP regen, etc. It sounds like you completely don't understand the champion that you're commenting on, if you think his passive is the only thing that makes him able to tank. Just building a simple Warmogg's and Rylai's and a chain mail instantly makes him a tank with MR per level runes, merc treads and your ult. Later you can finish a Frozen heart and you're a godlike tank, but not for his passive. It's for his ult and the HP and resistances you've got. Finish Force of Nature, and your move speed is through the roof when ult is on, HP regen is completely bonkers, and your Rylai's will provide the CC that your team needs out of a tank. Protecting carries effectively results in more damage than an RoA can offer, 100%.[/quote]

[quote=JunSupport]I guess Duff's definition of a "true tank" is different. lol[/quote]